|Delatour earns its stripes...||philippec|
Jul 8, 2003 7:21 AM
|JP Nazon's pounding away on the sprint bonuses gets Delatour the yellow jersey after a second-place yesterday and Finot's epic break-away -- good on Delatour, they have earned their place in this year's Tour IMHO.
|if they weren't french they would never be there in first place||cyclopathic|
Jul 8, 2003 8:05 AM
|get a grip|
|and the 2nd best man would be wearing yellow today||Frith|
Jul 8, 2003 8:15 AM
|I would like to see cipo in the tour as much as anyone but by not inviting deletour we would have missed a monumental break yesterday and the fastest rider thus far. |
What's to grip?
|yes we do have 2nd best in yellow today||cyclopathic|
Jul 8, 2003 8:21 AM
|with time bonuses Cipo'd be in yellow by now.|
|woulda coulda shoulda||Frith|
Jul 8, 2003 8:29 AM
|Maybe so...but the point is that delatour are not the lame duck everybody said they were. ONE OF THEM IS LEADING THE TOUR DE FRANCE. If there's a grip to be got it's yours. Sour grapes don't taste so good, do they?|
Jul 8, 2003 8:43 AM
|sh!ty team on cheapo publicity stun and what grapes?|
|Get a grip,||philippec|
Jul 8, 2003 8:17 AM
|French team, riding in French national tour gets yellow jersey -- where's the problem? They earned their place.
Cyclopathic, check out the 1st US Postal invitation to the Tour -- as a wild-card... everyone has got to start somewhere -- some of us start a bit behind the others though...
|Get a grip,||Jon Billheimer|
Jul 8, 2003 8:24 AM
|The problem, Philippe, is that LeTour is much, much more than a French national tour. It's the greatest race in the world, and to exclude superior teams in order featherbed French content demeans the event.|
|That indeed is the problem...||philippec|
Jul 8, 2003 8:30 AM
|It is the greatest bike race in the world ** and ** the only french national tour. The Italians have the Giro, the Spaniards have the Vuelta, most countries have their national tours (but not the US!, ... yet) and riders of those countries have plenty of opportunities to shine in front of the "home crowd" in their national tour -- but not in France. I'm just pointing this out so that you can see there are two sides ton the question -- and no, I don't have any answers..
|it would demean the event||rufus|
Jul 8, 2003 8:49 AM
|if, those teams getting in then just rode at the back stage after stage and eventually all dropped out. but once they get their chance to be in it, they enliven the stages by putting in their efforts, and going after stage wins and breaks. that's all you can ask for. happened the last few years, and is happening again this year.|
Jul 8, 2003 8:59 AM
|your argument would have worked in '01, maybe in '02. but in '03? inviting them instead World Champion's team? is TdF a subdivision of Paralympics? don't you think any non-french team with mediocre record would be invited 3 years in a row?|
Jul 8, 2003 1:26 PM
|The TDF is not a sub-division of the para-olympics, but is, as I stated above, France's national tour. This complicates things as I discussed above since french teams only have one chance to ride in their national tour.
If you are asking if I think a non-national team with a mediocre record would be invited to its national tour three, four even five times in a row -- the answer is yes -- look at the Vuelta, Giro, Tour of Germany, etc. where sub-par national teams participate every year. That it happens in the TDF also should come as no surprise. Again, I am not taking sides or saying that Domina Vacanze should not have been invited -- only that the decision to invite/not invite Delatour is/was more complicated then many think.
Now that they are there -- its great to see them fight for their place and build on lastr year's stage victory.
Jul 8, 2003 2:04 PM
I agree with most of your posts. It is a French tour and there should be a French flavor to the peleton but I think you are wrong to say that delatour deserves to be there because they have a man in yellow. They sent unfatigued guys on solo breaks to get pub and some time bonuses. Thanks to a few crashes and some luck they wind up with a guy at the top of GC. See how well they do in the TTT with a couple riders blown to bits.
I think if the Tour wants to remain THE premere cycling event, they had better start inviting the best racers in the world. To exclude the world champ for pack fill is simply wrong. If you cant see that, perhaps you will get your wish and the Tour will return to a francophile romp through the provinces and the real racing will take place at the Giro or Vuelta.
|I'd like to have it both ways...||philippec|
Jul 8, 2003 2:19 PM
|So here is my great plan -- rotate UCI points among the Giro, Vuelta, TDF. One year the Giro gets mega points, the next the Vuelta, the following year the Giro, etc. That way the TDF/Giro/Vuelta can share the responsability of being the "premier" cycling event.... That said, no one is breaking down the dioors to ask me how to organise international cycling, at least not yet! ;-)
Don't kid yourself about the Vuelta and Giro and " real racing", you know as well as I do that many more second rate spanish/italian teams get into the Vuelta/Giro than second-rate french teams get into the TDF. If either of these events had to choose teams w/ the same constraints as the TDF, you would see a lot of pissed off international squads being left out in the cold in favour of the Spanish and Italian "Jean Delatours"
So life is complicated, there are no easy answers, but I wish to god someone would pay me to find them!
Jul 8, 2003 2:23 PM
|your argument with Vuelta, Giro, Tour de Swisse, Germany, Belgium is flaud. THere's not that much competition, and as the matter of fact some teams turn down invitations and second division teams get inited as subs. And no team gets invitation at expense of other as it repeatedly happened in TdF.
Now I say it again if Paralympic Wild Card selection Leblanc is fond of is the only way french teams can get in, I am sorry for french cycling.
|whoop de doooo||EpicX|
Jul 8, 2003 6:36 PM
|being world champion doesn't entitle you to an invite to any race you want. would Cipo have made things interesting? probably. but can you honestly say that the last 3 days have not been pretty damn exciting? Massive pileups, 160km breaks caught with 2km to go, great sprint finishes. Petacchi proved in the Giro that he was a match for Mario and now he's proving that he's a match for anyone else.
hey it's the french national tour and wildcards are just that, wild. you want a GUARANTEED spot in the tour, win the Giro, or the Vuelta or be in the top 10 teams. DO NOT however pin your tour hopes on ONE rider no matter how flamboyant or what titles he may have.
in the end the wildcard spots are at the mercy of LeBlanc and as such you just can't pin your hopes on them.