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Women want it both ways...(28 posts)

Women want it both ways...ClydeTri
May 20, 2003 10:49 AM

They want single sex health clubs..but they dont want men to have single sex golf clubs...double standard?
I want single sex golf clubs and integrated health clubs (nm)TJeanloz
May 20, 2003 10:53 AM
re: Women want it both ways...rufus
May 20, 2003 10:54 AM
they just don't want you staring at them when they're using the thigh press machine. ;)
Clear double-standard against leering creeps here! (nm)czardonic
May 20, 2003 11:08 AM
women. ha! what are you gonna do? nmmohair_chair
May 20, 2003 11:36 AM
And I, want to oblige. nm n m nm n nM! M! M! ; )128
May 20, 2003 11:45 AM
Whereas men, of course, insist on fairness and equality (nm)cory
May 20, 2003 12:24 PM
I heard a rumor that Cory.....Starliner
May 20, 2003 2:11 PM
... is going to move to L.A. and will be conducting post-game locker room interviews with the local WNBA team. :->
ah, the real reason for being a writer nmDougSloan
May 20, 2003 2:15 PM
Actually, Doug, you've stumbled on the truth...cory
May 21, 2003 7:52 AM
When I got out of the Army and went to register for college (in the pre-computer, stand-in-line days), there were two lines totalling 20,000-plus students. At the end of one were a couple of offensive linemen from the football team. At the end of the other was a group of pretty nice-looking girls (I'd call them "women" now, but I was a Republican then). I talked to them for five or six hours, later dated two of them and wound up marrying one. But while I was single, being a magazine writer was a great excuse to walk up and talk to anybody at all.
perfect pickup lineDougSloan
May 21, 2003 8:09 AM
The perfect pickup line: "Hi, I'm a writer. Care to answer a few questions?" Just about as good as "Playboy 'talent' scout."

perfect pickup lineTJeanloz
May 21, 2003 9:37 AM
I used to write (and do the analysis for) extensive research reports on companies for investment analysis - about 80% of my job was just writing. When it came time to tell the ladies what I did:

Me: "I'm a writer"

Her: "What do you write"

Me: "Descriptive prose, mostly"

Her: "That's really fascinating"

Me: "Yeah, sometimes when things are slow I do some modeling on the weekends" (building financial models, that is)

It was a pretty good gig...
Better than 'I'm a writer' isOldEdScott
May 21, 2003 9:44 AM
'I'm a freelance writer.' For some reason, girls think 'freelance' sounds glamorous.

What we writers know that they don't is 'freelance' means 'between jobs' or 'unemployed.'
misleading subject line ...sacheson
May 20, 2003 12:43 PM
... you drew me into a boring topic with a falsely provocative subject line. I think there's some grounds for a suit there ... ;-)
double standard has such a bad reputationDougSloan
May 20, 2003 1:16 PM
The world is rife with double standards. I'm sure we could come up with several thousand. Doesn't make sense, but not much does.

I think the issue boils down to "who's complaining?" Not many men have a serious complaint about female only clubs, as they are missing many legitimate opportunities. The opposite might be true for women.

sounds like wisdom from an ostrichStarliner
May 20, 2003 2:15 PM
Try using the same argument with a group of feminists. They'll educate you as to why it's not an issue to brush off.
maybe my support for them is misplaced, thenDougSloan
May 20, 2003 2:19 PM
My message supports women and their right to have separate groups but not men. However, if they truly believe all groups should be open to everyone, I'll retract it.

Are you saying....Starliner
May 20, 2003 3:05 PM
... that you support women and their right (?) to have separate groups, but that men don't have that right?? Please clarify if that's what you mean.

As a related aside, should gender discrimination be an allowed practice in schools? Here's an admissions form for a local all girl's school - note the disclaimer at the bottom...

These schools have tax-exempt status, meaning that contributions made to the school are tax-deductable. I guess you'd have to ask whether these schools are really necessary - considering how well girls and co-eds are doing compared to their male counterparts these days, one might argue that there is no need for such discriminatory admission policies in education. But to justify giving federal tax exempt status to institutions that discriminate? The house of cards is ready to fall on this one.
VMI and Citadel ...ClydeTri
May 20, 2003 4:57 PM
were taken to court by women and forced to admit women....yet there are still all women take? men and women are different! yes we all knew that, but sometimes it makes sense to have exclusionary policies for men and women ...I agree that women should be able to have single sex health clubs, just as men should be able to and to have a golf club that doestn have women members....
VMI and Citadel ...Starliner
May 20, 2003 5:22 PM
Having equal gender opportunity for education is somewhere higher on the scale of importance than where you'll find health clubs and golf clubs IMO.

But perhaps the main issue is not whether same sex schools or clubs should exist, but whether or not tax exempt status should be given to any entity which practices discriminatory admission or membership policies.

Here's a case which suggests it's not OK:
As usual53T
May 23, 2003 8:21 AM
Most barroom arguments confuse what is right with "what is the right role of government" Clearly the courts have found women to be a traditionally oppressed minority (even though they are a majority, but whose counting). Men in general are not a traditionally oppressed minority, in fact we are traditional oppressors.

Yes, gender should not be a criteria for sharing in the public wealth, such as in a school that receives public funds (thay all do to varying extents), and other public accomodadtions. What we witness in the newspapers is women's use of the police powers of the state to enforce what is right (equal access). We say "women want X", when if fact the news is that "women want the federal goverment to enforce X". What women want is largely inconsequantial, what the federal government enforces can have serious consequences. The difference between men and women in this issue is women's access to redress due to their status as a traditionally oppressed minority

Of course this line of reasoning is very boring. We much prefer to argue about whether it is right to have equal access. When someone suggests we debate the proper role of government at the federal and state levels in enforcing questions of civil rights, he is typically met with yawns and changing the topic to last night's baseball scores.

When this changes, America will reach a new level of greatness. I look forward to that day.
Well said. nmKristin
May 23, 2003 10:17 AM
Thank you (nm)53T
May 23, 2003 10:56 AM
re: Women want it both ways...Spoiler
May 20, 2003 4:58 PM
What we really need is seperate health clubs for the geniuses who feel the need to do 15lb barbell curls in the squat rack. Or the squishy turds who slide a bench under the Smith machine and proceed to do 1/4 bench reps with 50lbs. Or the yacking harpies who stand 6 inches away from the bench and jabber into their cell phones while I'm trying to finish a set of 5x5's without imbedding the bar in my sternum.
OR the roided out time machines who still wear zebra Ottomix clown pants, bandannas, and lifting belts while doing tri extensions.
Or the Guido's who spash on a bottle of AquaVelva, leaving a wafting trail of toxic fumes following them from machine to machine.
Stupidity is gender-neutral.
Hilarious- help me up off the floor!-nmfiltersweep
May 21, 2003 7:33 AM
happens everywhereJS Haiku Shop
May 21, 2003 9:58 AM
you just described my most recent trips to the mall, the grocery store, and Best Buy.
Classic! Nothing writes like experience. nm128
May 21, 2003 11:15 AM
re: Women want it both ways...Duane Gran
May 21, 2003 10:35 AM
Without a doubt this is a double standard, but ultimately it might be a move in the right direction. I support the right of a business owner to deny service to anyone for any reason. In the case of prejudice they hurt themselves, but it opens up the market for a competing niche. The law can try to establish equality and fair play, but it never works out that way in practice.

In this particular case I imagine the one's who are really ticked off are the competitors who run co-ed gymns, whose marketing seems to imply that they are stock full of 20-something hotties.

I'm going to go back to my treehouse. No girls allowed. ;)