|Do you think Serena Williams takes drugs?....||Bruno S|
Jan 3, 2003 7:59 PM
|the Salon post in the general board got me thinking about how different the Williams sisters look from other tennis players. Look at the picture, she looks like a body builder. She is only 21 y/o. It just doesn't seem natural to me. If I recall correctly tennis players do not get screened for drugs like cyclists do (or at least so often). Man, I bet she has stronger legs than some men pro tennis players.|
|Great photo of a fine female form, very strong ...nm||rwbadley|
Jan 3, 2003 10:36 PM
|baby definately got back! ...nm||ColnagoFE|
Jan 6, 2003 7:04 AM
|baby definately got back! ...nm||No_sprint|
Jan 7, 2003 10:57 AM
|I could put my Coors Light on that baby. mmmmm...|
|re: Do you think Serena Williams takes drugs?....||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 4, 2003 6:34 AM
|I do not think her build means she is on something. I know many women with an athletic build who are not on drugs. Serena may look muscular, but she also looks feminine. I think testing should be done on all tennis players though.
Jan 4, 2003 10:23 AM
|Look at that hair and the outfit she's wearing. Definitely onsomething.: )|
|Sintesio?????? Are you the same as Sintesi????? (nm)||eyebob|
Jan 6, 2003 7:31 AM
|Si. Home login (nm)||Sintesi|
Jan 6, 2003 8:34 AM
|Good Pickup EyeBob||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 6, 2003 8:43 AM
|These are the worst kinds of trolls. I hate when people try to post with something simular to a well known poster. They will is a "q" instead of a "g", a Zero instead of an "O" OR A 1 instead of a lower case "l" to name a few tricks.
Someone did that to a freind of mine on another message board. THey made posts under a screen name appeared to be identical. He started to get hateful emails from people because some troll did not like him.
Whatch for these if you see a post that is way out of character for someone. Nice work Bob.
|Good to know it is the real Sintesi n/m||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 6, 2003 8:45 AM
|and what about J. Capriati.....||ebatl|
Jan 6, 2003 6:39 AM
|I find it odd that you don't ask the same question about Jennifer Capriati. Take a look at the arms/shoulders on this girl:
These questions only seem to come up for the Williams sisters, Barry Bonds, Marion Jones, Sammy Sosa, Tiger Woods, etc. Hmmmm...what do they all have in common???
Nobody gave a rat's ass about Mark McGwire obvious steroid usage when he was "saving America's pastime" a few years ago.
Get a clue!
|must be the heroin...nm||mohair_chair|
Jan 6, 2003 7:21 AM
|That's not true,||TJeanloz|
Jan 6, 2003 7:49 AM
|1. I don't know of a single allegation that Tiger Woods has used performance enhancing drugs.
2. Were you under a rock when Mark McGwire's use of Androstendione was the biggest media story of the summer of 1998, outside of the fact that he broke the HR record?
3. Ken Caminiti admitted steroid usage, and people gave a rats ass about it this summer.
|That's not true,||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 6, 2003 8:34 AM
|Baseball was a joke last summer. They are all trying to avoid testing for steroids. They would say steroids has nothing to do with the skill it takes to hit a ball at 90 MPH. It makes you wonder any time you see someone who goes from hitting 5 home runs to hitting 30.
I do not think Tiger Woods is on Drugs. He works out and has changed the way a lot of other pro golfers think about working out. Steroids would not help a golfer, they would hut him. It is all not about strength and power. It is about flexibility and quickness.
I feel bad for Capriotti. She had a tough childhood with parents who tried to throw her on the tour way too young. I was happy she did well when she got her head on straight. When you see someone become so good so quickly, you have to wonder if they are on something. Especially when there is a big change in the body type. I guess you like to beleive the best until proven otherwise.
Tennis is one of few sports where I beleive the women make as much as the men. If some big names tested positive then it would hurt the sport a lot. It would be nice to know it was fair.
|and what about J. Capriati.....||Bruno S|
Jan 6, 2003 8:28 AM
|Yes, on that photo she looks also like a body builder as well. She is much older though (early thirties?). I'm sure Tiger doesn't take any think because of the nature of sports and I sure baseball and football are plaged with drugs (for in and out of the court).|
|and what about J. Capriati.....||ebatl|
Jan 6, 2003 9:21 AM
|I didn't have to look hard at all to find that picture of Capriati...it was the 1st picture of her that I came across (just went to USTA). It is representative of her physique. I notice her build every time I see her play, particularly her upper body.
Your original post suggested that Serena Williams has a physique unlike her opponents. Jennifer was Serena's major competition in 2002, yet you didn't notice her muscularity. How could you have overlooked that?
My bigger question for the forum is this: Why is it that our society has such a hard time accepting achievement without questioning the character of the person making the accomplishment. This seems to especially hold true for Black athletes.
Being a professional athlete means that your job is to train, eat, sleep, then train some more. If you or I were to do that all day every day then our bodies would show incredible form and definition. Add to the mix that people who have reached the highest levels of their sport are already superior athletes to begin with. What type of body do you expect these folks to have?
Jan 6, 2003 9:33 AM
|You can't see that Serena Williams physique is so markedly different from every other top tennis players (with Capriati being the only close one and I would say equally suspect) including her sister's to the point where drug usage might be suspected?
Some of the biggest names in doping are not black. How about Alzedo, Bosworth? What about the recurring allegations against Armstrong?
And Tiger Woods? What doping has he ever been accused of?
McGwire admitted to using a testosterone precursor that probably has very little anabolic affect certainly nothing compared to steroids, and he got alot of negative flak for it.
Remember the Boy Who Cried Wolf story?
Jan 6, 2003 10:47 AM
|Jennifer has a bit of steroid-jaw. Serina doesn't show that symptom. Obviously, both are heavy into weight training, and are apparntly good at it. Big muscles are not enought to indicate steroids. You have to look at more pictures for hair-lip, hair on chin, wide jaw, voice clues, etc. Of course it's more fun just to look at her booty!|
|Isn't it also the...||Wayne|
Jan 6, 2003 11:16 AM
|quality, for lack of a better word, the muscle? I used to lift weights alot and the gym I went to was infested by juicers (there was eventually a police raid there). Anyway, it seemed that "steroid" muscle looked different than normal muscle. It was more vascular and had a puffy quality to it. Hard to explain, but along with stuff like acne, etc it always seemed pretty easy to tell who was taking the stuff and who wasn't.|
|THey start playing too young||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 6, 2003 12:48 PM
|You are right about the jaw. That is a tell tale sign. It is hard go be sure 100% though. She looks like wrestler Chyna in that picture.
What makes me questions it is when you see a sudden increase in someone's performance, much like Capriotti had two years ago. Martina Navratalova had a simular spike in the 80s. She went from a femanine build to a lean ripped look but not as bulky.
Drugs are not always the case though. Aggasi went though a conditioning program but did not bulk up. It helped his game a lot though. THen again men play 5 sets and endurance is more of an issue then strength.
Either way, testing should be done. In womens tennis you have 14-18 year old girls popping up on the tour. You would hate here of a 16 year old girl with serious health problems because some coach or trainer puts her on the juice.
|Perfromance is no indicator||53T|
Jan 6, 2003 1:51 PM
|My cycling performance took a great leap, as a result of better training, no drugs involved. Performance alone can be very misleading. Lack of performance is also no reason to clear someone of suspicion. There are probably plenty of EPO guys in the peleton who haven't won anything.
I'm not so sure about the "qualty of muscle" issue raised above. I think muscle is muscle. Hydration, circulatory condition, and body fat content have a lot to do with how a body builder looks on a given day, but all these can be influenced independent of steroid use.
Acne is a symptom in guys, as is temper problems, and sexual problems. Females have other, more personal, gender specific symptoms.
|Perfromance is no indicator||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 6, 2003 4:47 PM
|I think it can be in most sports. It is not always an indicator but it can be. I think we have all had some quick improvement in one sport or another. I am by no means accusing everyone of it. For most people an increase in training time will show better performance.
I am just thinking of it more in a case where you have someone who was a good performer who makes a drastic increase in a short period of time. Rumsas in this years TDF comes to mind. Michelle Smith, the Irish Swimmer is another. There have been many baseball players who have doubled their home run numbers over the course of an off season such as Nomar Garciapara to name one. I am not sure if he was a result of just better training or if he took drugs to help, buit his statements this summer saying Baseball should not test made him very suspect.
I think you reach a point where your training can only do so much and you hit a wall. You may have that in a cyclist who is a borderline pro who hits the wall and takes something to get a pro contract. Same can true for a second tier tennis pro jorneyman outfielder and many other athletes.
|I think just about ALL pro athletes take drugs...||cory|
Jan 6, 2003 9:15 AM
|I've posted on this before, but an acquaintance of mine is a pro sports agent, with a number of clients you'd recognize. We've talked about this occasionally. His experience is that virtually all pros at the top levels of any sport are using some kind of "performance enhancing" chemical, either banned or legal. The difference between not quite making the team and making it, or being an average player earning $250,000 a year and a star earning $2 million, is just so small, and the careers so short, that many athletes will do almost anything to cross the line.|
|I think it's hard to know one way or the other...||Wayne|
Jan 6, 2003 9:46 AM
|but I tend toward your view. I went home to my po-dunk hometown for Christmas and one of my high school buddies was telling me about mutual old friends who are now on the juice to get big. For absolutely no sporting reason! I know I would have done them in high school if I could have gotten my hands on them. It's hard to believe that when millions are potentially on the line, that athletes wouldn't take the chance of risking their health to be a star rather than an also ran or worse going to work with the local construction crew!|
|I think it's hard to know one way or the other...||ebatl|
Jan 6, 2003 11:51 AM
|Alzado and Bosworth were/are admitted dopers, neither of whom ever distinguished themselves as the best in their profession. They're both in the vein (pun intended) of current day steroid fiend Bill Romanowski. Everybody knows he's on the juice but he is still allowed to play in the NFL.
Serena is a powerful woman. So is Lindsay Davenport. The difference....Serena is fitter and faster. She got that way by working out, eating right, etc. Why can't her success be attributed to just those factors? Even Lindsay's game improved markedly after she got fit/lost weight and quit relying solely on her ability to overpower opponents.
All I'm saying is that these type of questions never got raised in tennis until Serena and Venus started dominating women's tennis. Anyone who has followed their careers saw them coming and is not surprised by their dominance. If other women on the tour want to compete with them they are going to have to train harder/outwork them to get better. You know...the American way!
By the way, it's not crying wolf to observe that these criticisms are more often leveled towards Black athletes. That's just the way it is. Hell, is Picabo Street on 'roids. She came back from a devastating knee injury to return to the top of women's skiing? What about Annika Sorenstam...surely she must be cheating in some way to dominate women's golf the way that she does, right? Oh yeah, that Mia Hamm chick has GOT to be on something to be able to play soccer the way that she does.
I could go on and on, but you see my point...nobody questions these women's fitness, skill, or stamina. It is assumed that they got where they are because of hard work, skill, training, etc.
|I think you're missing one...||Wayne|
Jan 6, 2003 11:56 AM
|of the key things. Serena Williams looks like she is on steroids (Venus does not). I think that's largely the source of accusations concerning her.|
|No..you're missing my point.....||ebatl|
Jan 6, 2003 12:31 PM
|She looks like a person who trains hard. As I stated earlier, any athlete at the top of their profession who has a personal trainer, personal chef, etc. AND who has the athletic foundation/genetics upon which to build can look that way.
We are just not used to seeing muscular tennis players..especially on the women's side of the game. Why must we assume that she is on steroids because she looks different than what we are used to? The days of Chris Evert standing on the baseline hitting two-handed backhands is over. It's a speed and power game now.
By the way, have you looked at Amelie Mauresmo (#6 player last year). She's pretty muscular. How about Arantxa Sanchez-Vicario? She's looks manly.
I may be off base with some of the racial stuff, but I don't think so. The initial posting rubbed me that way when the guy said that she looks so much different than her competitors when her main competitor (Capriatri) has shoulders to match Serena's. I guess he'd never seen Capriati before....
Jan 6, 2003 1:57 PM
|I really don't like speculating about people doing things that might be cheating or illegal, especially when based upon 3rd hand gossip (some people should know better) or merely looking at someone. They might look like a body builder because they train like a body builder. Who knows? Why gossip about someone and imply they are a cheat when you don't really know?
This "Team Estrogen" gal really looks more like a "Team Testosterone" gal, doesn't she? She must be on drugs, don't you think?
Jan 6, 2003 5:19 PM
|Some sports like cycling & Football have taken steps clean themselves up. Other sports like baseball, basketball, and if what I have read is correct, tennis have not.
I think you are right, naming names is not fair. I probably should have not done that in one of my posts. But until some of the sports crack down on drugs, people will think the worst and their top athletes will be suspect.
|this proves my point exactly....||ebatl|
Jan 6, 2003 5:52 PM
|I can understand the suspicion in some sports where there have been documented cases of performance enhancing drug usage, but to my knowledge, there have NEVER been even hints that tennis players may be steroid users..either men or women. Why is there a need to crack down on drugs in a sport where no one has ever been found to be using drugs?
Even in the sports that have taken steps to clean themselves up (you mentioned cycling and football), the athletes involved are STILL under suspicion...even after they test clean.
It seems to me that this "suspicion" in tennis has only come about recently. When Steffi Graf was winning title after title, no one suspected her of anything.
|this proves my point exactly....||Alpedhuez55|
Jan 6, 2003 7:59 PM
|Take Baseball. Nobody has been suspended. But they do not test. Is there a perfomance enhancing drug problem in Baseball? I think the answer is yes.
Would we have eliminated drunk driving years ago if we is not do sobriety tests? No, The problem would be there. We just would not have the statistics to prove it. That is what goes on in some sports.
People will always try to get away with it. This years Giro showed you that. I think the fans of sports are getting tired of it judging from reaction to Baseballs problems this summer. We'll see what happens in the rest of the sports.