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Lucky night...(28 posts)

Lucky night...Matno
Dec 12, 2002 12:37 AM
Or unlucky, depending on how you look at it. I just spent several hours wringing out towels as fast as I could soak up the water on the floor. We had a water pipe break on the 20th floor (I live on the 4th). It was gushing through our walls like a waterfall for an hour before maintenance got somebody here to shut it off. It's mostly stopped seeping now, and I'll have to say we were lucky. We kept it completely contained with the towels. Aside from some wood floor tiles that will warp (they're cheap) and possibly some walls that will need repainting (very easy) we have nothing to show for it. All of the apartments below ours had ankle deep water throughout the entire apartments! Apparently, some above us did too. I guess maybe our walls let the water pass through better than others? Not much time left to sleep tonight. Too bad I have to meet a guy who's buying my car at 8:30, and then I have to lead a group discussion on hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (for which I am completely unprepared) at 9:00. Oh well. Such is life! At least I'm not looking for a place to spend the night and adding up replacement costs for our furniture like the neighbors are doing... :^( Our maintenance here is horrible. Last I heard, they were bringing some shop vacs over to suck up some of the water. Problem was, they were bringing them from Queens (1/2 an hour away!) You'd think in NYC a complex with nearly 700 apartments would have something like that on location! Okay, I'm going to bed now...
I didn't expect you to reply.grace
Dec 12, 2002 9:26 AM
because you have a history on this board of not taking responsibility for your lies.

Posted by: grace
Dec-04-02, 01:03 PM "Well I guess Critmass was right about you."

You were so assured of your 80% FACT. Guess it was a phantom figure like your front- page newspaper article. And so it goes..

Posted by: Matno
Dec-04-02, 01:14 "You can look it up if you want"

http://www.chron.com/content/archive/index.mpl
I'll stand by it 100%. Whether it's accurate or not, it WAS on the front page of the paper. (For that matter, is it shocking to you? Where I grew up, it was no surprise. There was no huge public outcry after it was published). Where do you live?

Posted by: grace
Dec-04-02, 01:36 PM "100% ? Are you sure?"

I just called the paper at 713 220 2700 and talked to a woman named Alma. She did an extensive search and said there was NEVER such an article. Much less on the FRONT-PAGE. Like I said I guess Critmass was right about you!

Posted by: Matno
Dec-04-02, 01:56 PM "Baloney!"

I don't believe for a minute that you actually called. If you searched thoroughly, you would find it. It was when I lived in Houston, which was in the late 80's. There was a bar graph comparing the various numbers. Keep in mind what I originally said: this was the number of people arrested and taken to jail, not necessarily convicted (you can find the stats for convictions pretty easily). Also keep in mind that racial profiling was and is alive and well. If you have numbers that are different, feel free to share them.

Posted by: grace
Dec-04-02, 02:04 PM "Baloney!"

Call the number I gave and ask for Alma. Give her all your information about this. If you're right and she isn't she will give you the date it was published. Post that date and I will call Alma back and verify it. It's pretty simple to figure out who is LYING here!
he dropped this point tooMJ
Dec 12, 2002 9:38 AM
MJ "GM foods - what's the fuss? Better dead than GM-fed?" 12/3/02 5:37am

but don't be so hard on him - it's rare to find someone who is so wrong who is convinced he is so right and that everyone else doesn't have a clue - it's very entertaining - just think there's lots of people out there like Matno - they just blend in - they tie their shoes, feed themselves, and worryingly can carry firearms and vote!!

most posters, even those who might have some sympathy with his extreme right wing positions, seem to have picked up on Matno's credibility issue

but that's the thing with style over substance - if you wrap yourself in quasi-patriotic and religious ideology and stock phrases most simply do not question facts or whether you actually exhibit any of the beliefs you allegedly espouse
I couldn't care less about him.grace
Dec 12, 2002 9:53 AM
His use of lies to try and make his absurd points and his denial of responsibility for those lies is what makes him so ludicrous. I am not being any harder on him than his own dishonesty is on himself.
and so it goes.
LOL - nmMJ
Dec 12, 2002 10:02 AM
I just stopped checking the threads that far down.Matno
Dec 12, 2002 6:26 PM
You asked:
answer these questions with reference to scripture:
Would Jesus support the death penalty?
If you believe as I do that He was the God of the Old Testament, then he obviously commanded it in certain circumstances and following proper legal protocol. There always had to be accusers and a "hearing" of sorts under the Law of Moses. When Jesus said "he who is without sin, let him cast the first stone" it was because he knew that none would step forward to accuse her personally (probably because of their own guilt). He followed up with "Woman, where are thine accusers?" and told her to sin no more. Many people take this to mean that the Jewish law of stoning was no longer in effect, even though that law was not actually fulfilled (nor changed) until Christ's atonement.

Would Jesus refuse the poor health care?
Certainly not on a personal level. Nor have I ever advocated that. If you've read my posts, then you'll know that under my "ideal" system, there would be a higher expectation of aid from individuals. (And I think people would step up, if they had any sort of moral values). On the other hand, Christ never said that the gov't had a responsibility to care for the sick. It's an individual responsibility.

Would Jesus refuse people education?
The Bible makes no direct reference to this that I know of. However, I'm sure that Jesus would encourage us to get as much education as possible. My church has an education fund whereby poor people (particularly in poor countries) benefit from the donations of those who have more. When they have received an education, they pay the money back, and are then encouraged to contribute to the fund so that others may likewise benefit. Through this program, thousands have already had opportunities they never thought possible.

Would Jesus refuse people food?
Nope, and neither would I. Giving food to the poor is a noble endeavor, and it seems a shame that we waste such a huge percentage of that money on gov't bureacracy. I imagine that the return on your tax dollars that go to the welfare system are less than 50%. When it goes through my church, I know that 100% of it goes to those in need.

Would Jesus refuse to help people whose behaviour resulted in sickness or other problems?
No, and I hope you didn't get the impression that I would advocate that either. Once again, you are failing to make the distinction between individuals and government. Individuals should give. Gov't pretty much takes and wastes. (If you can think of any private organization that is less efficient than the gov't, they're probably already out of business).

Does Jesus forbid consumption of alcohol?
Not in the Bible. But do you think He was EVER drunk? Not a chance. The very idea flies in the face of His Deity.
As an aside...eyebob
Dec 12, 2002 10:51 AM
I like the idea that this forum basically self-polices itself. There are several posters who are quite good at holding people to their posts so to speak. It makes it continually worth while to come back because a fraud is exposed eventually. I'm not calling Matno a fraud. I'm simply trying thank those of you who hold peoples feet to the fire for their comments. It's better for all us knowing that we can't just toss "facts" around without substantiation.

BT
I won't object if you want to call Manto a fraud :}critmass
Dec 12, 2002 1:13 PM
I think he'll reply to Grace that Alma at the Houston Chronicle is a Jewish black lesbian who got Aids from a Mali truck driver that got lost and somehow ended up in Houston because of a plot fermented by those black pinkos in South Africa. Now, not only does that Alma sure sound like she lacks credibility but our daughters are now the target of sex crazed African's who have already raped every woman available on that continent. I can assure you that he has all the facts to back up everything I've just said in a research paper he wrote while working on his sixth PHD.
I'm man enough to admit when I'm wrong.Matno
Dec 12, 2002 7:00 PM
I'm not willing to do the research to find that particular article. However, here is some similar information that is more recent. My percentage was right, but when I said "by age 21," according to this I should have said "by age 35." I apologize for the confusion. Please note, that I also pointed out that racial profiling likely plays a large role in the numbers. Also, I've noticed that some drug laws tend to be somewhat racially "biased" due to the fact that they target drugs more commonly used among African Americans, which obviously affects the relative arrest rates.

http://www.ncianet.org/dchob.html
(It has its own reference section if you want to double check anything).

(I'll quote the relevant part of this widely published paper here, which refers specifically to Washington DC in 1991: "an average of 1,250 African American males ages 18-35 can expect to have charges filed against them each month. When this data is set against the census data for the District and national figures on the percentage of those charged with no prior arrests, we find that an 18 year old African American male traversing the 17 years to reach age 35 has a 70 percent chance of having charges leveled at him. When the data for arrests in the District are examined, however, the scenario becomes much more frightening...Thus the likelihood of being arrested for a young African-American male will likely approach 70-75 percent by the time the person reaches age 35...the lifetime risk of arrest for an African American male residing in D.C. approaches the 90th percentile."

By the way, why on earth would I lie about something like this? I have nothing to prove. Somebody asked a question, so I provided an answer that I happened to have seen. Several of you were quick to jump all over me (for reasons I can't think of), but nobody offered any information to the contrary. The truth is a good form of self-policing on this forum. Some people seem to be oblivious to it.
What HOGWASH!!!!!critmass
Dec 12, 2002 7:54 PM
First you say your 100% SURE that there was an front page article in the 1980's in the Houston paper that says 75% of black males NATIONWIDE have been arrested by age 21. When that goes up in smoke thanks to Grace actually talking to the paper you bring out something from 1990 concerning the SMALL District of Columbia that TRIES to correlate D.C. figures to nationwide figures. Your article also said there is a CHANCE that 70 percent MAY have charges leveled against them, not that 70% nationwide HAS.
Manto you're a FRAUD!!!! You think you're so clever with your words. You can't fool all the people all the time!. You ask why you would lie. The only reason I can think of is to be an anonymous "someone important" on the net because you don't have that sense in real life.
Hello.Matno
Dec 13, 2002 5:28 AM
First I said I saw an article in the Houston Chronicle in the late 80's that showed some numbers. Then I showed you a study from 1991 that showed almost identical numbers. I am not claiming that the numbers are accurate, only that they were published. Sheesh. Give it up already. Why are you trying so hard to discredit me for something somebody else said? Did I say something that made you bitter because it hit home? That study I just posted shows accurate numbers for DC. It also uses statistically sound methods for correlating those numbers to the rest of the nation. (Have you ever taken statistics?) Of course those numbers may not be perfect (they're "statistics"!) but given the large numbers used, they are more likely than not quite accurate. As for Grace's alleged phone call, it's a lot easier to not find something than it is to find something. Especially over the phone. Add to that the fact that electronic records of stuff from the 80's is sketchy at best, and more likely on cumbersome microfiche. The fact that "Alma" couldn't find anything means absolutely nothing. (Unless you think that people who answer phones at places like that are smart, which they rarely are). I'm sure Grace didn't press the issue for more than a few minutes (it takes time to actually do research).

My original post was in reply to a discussion about a dumb movie that portrayed blatantly false myths about crime (i.e. that most of it was from white suburbanite kids). All I was doing was disproving that. Do you disagree?

You said" Your article also said there is a CHANCE that 70 percent MAY have charges leveled against them, not that 70% nationwide HAS. Actually, what is said is that each individual HAS a 70% chance of getting charged with something. That means that that 70% of them WILL if current rates remain the same. As is usually the case around here, I get plenty of personal attacks because there's nothing wrong with the actual content of what I'm saying. Instead vilifying my credibility, why don't you try to come up with something to show that I'm wrong? It's easy to say I'm wrong, but if I am, it should be easy to actually show it rather than just shouting it. If not, leave me alone.
CAN YOU EVER BE HONEST ABOUT WHAT YOU'VE SAID?critmass
Dec 13, 2002 8:43 AM
Your EXACT words as Grace pointed out below ""I remember a front page article in the Houston Chronicle with statistics showing that 75% of black males nationwide had been in jail at least once by the time they were 21"
We all have a CHANCE of getting cancer therefore we WILL. That is your kind of logic? That is the typical way you have used words and false facts to support your conclusions on this board. You can't fool all the people all the time Manto. Your blind insistance of your innocence just makes you that much more pathetic.
it reminds me of those jokesMJ
Dec 13, 2002 9:17 AM
when did you stop beating your wife?
how long have you been a racist?
do you jerk off 3 or 4 times per day?

logic as packaging only impresses people who believe you
So when you say you're 100% sure of somethinggrace
Dec 12, 2002 10:27 PM
it means you may not be telling the truth? Like when your say "I remember a front page article in the Houston Chronicle with statistics showing that 75% of black males nationwide had been in jail at least once by the time they were 21"
Your article doesn't even come close to saying that. Now I know for sure that Alma was right and you were not being truthful. I don't suppose you want to get into your 80% rape figures. You know you shouldn't have insinuated that I wasn't telling the truth about calling the Houston Chronicle. It came back to bite you hard.
I'll leave you to all your so called facts.
And so it goes.
Matno, just ignore these morons.Jomo Kenyatta
Dec 13, 2002 8:20 AM
They're just being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative. Everything you've said sounds perfectly reasonable. Both Grace and Critmass have really said nothing regarding this issue, other than to criticize your numbers. They obviously can't refute them or they would have by now. I'd recommend that you be a little more careful about tossing numbers around if you want to avoid this kind of discussion in the future, but based on your past in this forum, it looks like you can usually back up what you say pretty well. Good luck!
The Pointcritmass
Dec 13, 2002 9:04 AM
Manto throws out whatever he can make up to make his point. The real point here is that there NEVER was the article in the Houston paper that he was 100% sure of. His FACTS were as bogus as they have been numerous times. You notice he has completely ignored Graces other point about the 80% rape figures. He does this continually on this board. When someone challanges his facts they are in a research paper he wrote and doesn't have time to find or he comes up with this D.C. study of D.C. crime not nationwide. If we all threw "facts" around as carelessly and with no regard for the truth as Manto we would be in the same cesspool of need to impress as him. All I ask of him is to be HONEST with himself and those here.
A Wise person once pointed out to me.............Len J
Dec 13, 2002 10:25 AM
that there was no need to shine light on a fool. Everyone whose oponion is valuable already can see the fool for what they are, so the only people you are trying to "educate" are those that don't care or will never see it.

He also asked me What buttons were being pushed in me that made my reaction so strong.......after all, that's all I can control anyway.

Len
Okay Yoda :}critmass
Dec 13, 2002 11:02 AM
I've only confronted Manto a couple of times on this board. The way he trolls with the most offensive statements he can conjure up damages not only his honesty but also those who think there is some truth to what he says. Sometimes the fool has to be held accountable for his foolishness. No matter the light. Your point is taken though.
99% of people surveyedMJ
Dec 13, 2002 9:15 AM
agree with you

BTW this figure is based on me being a:
lawyer;
doctor;
US special forces operative;
christian;
libertarian;
international humaintarian aid worker.

BTW I'm learning to fly with a cape and now wear my underwear outside of my clothes - I got your moron right here 'Jomo Kenyatta'...

cool handle by the way

LOL
Sorry you were floodedcarnageasada
Dec 12, 2002 6:37 PM
Thanks.Matno
Dec 12, 2002 7:01 PM
Finally, somebody nice! You've restored my faith in this forum! :^)
Sure, you're welcomecarnageasada
Dec 14, 2002 4:41 PM
I love abusing people as much as the next person but I prefer to wait for when they're at least standing up.

Seriously, I am sorry. About two weeks ago I came home from a great, three hour MTB ride with some good friends to find my wife pale-faced and the kids yelping and a horrible smell in the house. A sewage line had backed up. Even the bathtubs were full of raw sewage. When I read your post it reminded me of the sick feeling I had.
Ugh!Matno
Dec 15, 2002 2:39 PM
Oh the memories. My last apartment was in the basement of a large house that had a bad septic tank. Darn thing backed up twice in one year! Fortunately, the apartment on the other side of the basement was a little lower, so they got the brunt of it, but we still had a lot of mopping to do, and we had that horrible smell. Not in our tubs though! No wonder your wife's face was pale!
Flooded by the water, or by the release of pented-up anger? nmStarliner
Dec 13, 2002 9:18 AM
Maybe Matno is the reincarnation of Joseph Goebbels.ElaineK
Dec 13, 2002 12:01 PM
Why do I think he would welcome that comparison?
LOLgrace
Dec 15, 2002 1:20 PM
Normally I would think that comparison would be a little harsh. In this case the propaganda aspect has so many similarities that it seems true.
Uh oh, DOGPILE!Sintesi
Dec 16, 2002 5:25 AM
I don't know anything about your political views but an aparatment flood in the middle of winter, during the holidays just plain sucks. You have my sympathies and best wishes.
Thanks.Matno
Dec 16, 2002 3:16 PM
(And by the way, if you don't know anything about my political views, you may be the only one on this forum! I think you and I see eye to eye much of the time).