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Can't a brother catch a break?(16 posts)

Can't a brother catch a break?Wayne
Oct 24, 2002 9:08 AM
Long depicted as the perpetrators of your local liquor store hold-ups, drive-by shootings, and run-of-the-mill corner dope dealing, now black men are getting into the business of anti-government violence that once was only the realm of angry white males?
Alright, I'm assuming alot about the latter part of that statement but they are reporting that they searched a paramilitary training facility in Alabama.
What do you think?
General Nutcase?
Timothy McVeigh like anti-government psycho?
Islamic sympathizer terrorist wanna-be?
Prognosticate now before we know the answer.
facts - can everyone relax now?trekkie1
Oct 24, 2002 9:17 AM
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=519&ncid=716&e=1&u=/ap/20021024/ap_on_re_us/sniper_shootings

Two Men Arrested in Sniper Case
9 minutes ago
By ALLEN G. BREED, Associated Press Writer

FREDERICK, Md. (AP) - A 41-year-old Army veteran and a teenager described as his stepson were arrested at a roadside rest stop Thursday for questioning in the three-week wave of deadly sniper attacks that have terrorized the Washington, D.C., area. A law enforcement source said a gun found in their car appeared to have the same caliber as the one used in the shootings.

AP Photo

AP Photo
Slideshow: D.C. Area Sniper Shootings

Fearful Parents Send Kids to School
(AP Video)
Two Men Arrested In Sniper Case
(Reuters)
Police Arrest Two in Sniper Case
(AP Video)


Related Links
• Timeline on Sniper Shootings (AP)



The official said police also found a scope and a tripod in the car. Police were awaiting ballistics tests on the gun.

"We're positive it's these guys," the official told The Associated Press on condition of anonymity.

The arrests — linked to a telephoned boast about a deadly Alabama robbery — raised hopes of a conclusion to the intensive and often frustrating investigation of the shootings that have killed 10 people and critically wounded three others since Oct. 2.

The men taken into custody were not immediately charged in the sniper attacks, but authorities made it clear the arrests were considered pivotal. A newspaper report said the men were motivated by anti-American bias; police in Washington state, where the men recently lived, said they were not part of any organized group.

A federal law enforcement source, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said authorities recovered a weapon, believed to be a rifle, from the suspects' car. The source did not have details about the gun or whether it was a .223-caliber like the weapon or weapons used in the sniper shootings.

President Bush (news - web sites) was told that federal authorities were reasonably sure the case had been solved, a senior administration official told The Associated Press, also on condition of anonymity.

"There's a strong feeling these people are related to the sniper shootings," said Douglas Gansler, state's attorney in Maryland's Montgomery County, where the sniper task force is based. Asked if he believed the sniper was still at large, he said "no."

The arrests occurred hours after authorities descended on a home in Tacoma, Wash., believed to hold clues important to the investigation. They then issued a nationwide alert for the car, spotted by a motorist and an attendant at the rest stop.

Charles Moose, the Montgomery County police chief who is leading the investigation, had said John Allen Muhammad, 42, was being sought for questioning in the slayings and called him "armed and dangerous." Authorities said Muhammad was traveling with John Lee Malvo, 17.

Muhammad served in the Army as a machinist and had no training as a sniper, according to a senior defense official. Another official said Muhammad was discharged from the Army in the mid-1990s.

The key break, authorities said, was a phone call to the sniper task force tip line suggesting investigators check out a liquor store robbery in "Montgomery." The caller claimed credit for both the robbery and the sniper shootings, officials said.

Investigators checking the tip matched it with a Sept. 21 liquor store robbery in Montgomery, Ala., in which two employees were shot, one fatally. Montgomery Mayor Bobby Bright said Malvo's fingerprint was found at the scene on a magazine about weapons, though he did not specify whether the print was found before or after the telephone call.

Police traced Malvo to the home in Tacoma that was searched Wednesday by authorities looking into the sniper shootings. Malvo had been living in the home with Muhammad, a source told
facts - can everyone relax now?trekkie1
Oct 24, 2002 9:19 AM
Police traced Malvo to the home in Tacoma that was searched Wednesday by authorities looking into the sniper shootings. Malvo had been living in the home with Muhammad, a source told the AP.

A composite sketch of the suspect in the liquor-store shootings was made and "there are some very good similarities" to Malvo, Montgomery Police Chief John Wilson said. He said the gun used in Alabama was not the same as the one in the Washington, D.C.-area shootings, however.

Members of the sniper task force arrested the men without incident at 3:19 a.m. off I-70 in Frederick County, Md., about 50 miles northwest of the nation's capital, said Larry Scott, an agent for the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. State police said the men offered no resistance.

The relationship between Malvo and Muhammad, who also goes by the name John Allen Williams, was not clear, but several newspapers reported that the teen is Muhammad's stepson.

The Seattle Times said Muhammad changed his name after converting to Islam.

Several federal sources told the Times that Muhammad and Malvo may have been motivated by anti-American sentiments in the wake of the Sept. 11 attacks. Both were known to speak sympathetically about the men who hijacked jetliners over Washington, New York and Pennsylvania, the sources told the newspaper.

Neither man was believed to be associated with the al-Qaida terrorist network, the sources said.

The Times reported that Muhammad was stationed at Fort Lewis outside Tacoma in the 1980s, served in the Gulf War (news - web sites) and was later stationed at Fort Ord, Calif. Malvo, who authorities said is a citizen of Jamaica, attended high school in Bellingham, Wash., last year.

The witnesses at the rest stop called police at 1 a.m. after they spotted the men sleeping inside one of the cars sought in the investigation — a blue 1990 Chevrolet Caprice with a New Jersey license plate. Micah Rasmussen, a spokesman for the New Jersey Department of Transportation, said the car was registered to Muhammad at a Camden, N.J., address.

Investigators spent several hours examining the Caprice before putting it in a white trailer and towing it away. With news of the arrests filling the airwaves, truckers blew their horns as they passed by the rest stop.

On Wednesday, FBI (news - web sites) agents spent hours at the Tacoma home, eventually carting away a tree stump from the yard and other potential evidence in a U-Haul truck.

Scott, the ATF spokesman, said the stump would be brought to the agency's lab in Rockville, Md. On background, law enforcement sources said they believed it might contain bullets or fragments.

A Fort Lewis spokesman did not return a call for comment on whether Muhammad was stationed on the base.

FBI agents visited Bellingham High School, 90 miles north of Seattle, on Wednesday, reportedly seeking information about Muhammad and Malvo. Mayor Mark Asmundson said both left the area about nine months ago.

Bellingham Police Chief Randy Carroll said his force had known about Malvo since December 2001, when a police officer at the high school filed a suspicious persons report because the youth arrived at the school without transcripts or other papers. At one point, he lived with Muhammad as father and son at the Lighthouse Mission, a homeless shelter, Carroll said.

Carroll said investigators believed the two arrested men were acting on their own, not as part of a group.

Pfc. Chris Waters, a Fort Lewis soldier who lives across the street from the Tacoma home, said he called police after hearing gunshots in the neighborhood nearly every day in January.

"It sounded like a high-powered rifle such as an M-16," he said. "Never more than three shots at a time. Pow. Pow. Pow."

One of Muhammad's ex-wives, Mildred, was questioned by the FBI on Wednesday, said Adele Moses, who identified herself as the woman's sister. She said Mildred
Where have you gone Louis Armstrong?RoyGBiv
Oct 24, 2002 9:57 AM
This seems to change the paradigm, doesn't it?
Why did we all assume this was the work of a white guy?
Whatever happened to Louis Farrakhan?
probably because most serial killers have been white (nm)ColnagoFE
Oct 24, 2002 10:11 AM
TacomaTypeOne
Oct 24, 2002 10:51 AM
If this is the guy, I'm also a bit surprised that he isn't white. Then again, if he is Muslim and anti-American it makes sense, huh?

I went to college in south Tacoma in the late 80s, near where a lot of Ft. Lewis soldiers lived. I don't know if I ever rode through this guy's old neighborhood, but I would say that most everyone in that section of town fits the profile of a serial killer - there's a poor, disgruntled loner who possesses lots of firearms on every block.
I used to ride my bike a bit in those days, and I'll never forget the day a dog raced out of a yard and chased me. I rode hard, but found an even higher cadence when a shirtless guy stepped out of the house, yelled the dog's name and fired a handgun into the air. The dog stopped and turned around, so I guess his method of dog training worked.
Or maybe it's just Tacoma in general. Remember, this is where Ted Bundy grew up.
But just barelyMcAndrus
Oct 25, 2002 4:32 AM
A factoid from the 10/25/02 Wall Street Journal. "...out of 514 sniper murders between 1976 and 2000, 55% of the murderers were white." I know sniper murderer does not equal mass murderer but it's still an interesting statistic and I wonder if the comparison holds for mass murderers.
and whites are 75% of the U.S. population in 2000trekkie1
Oct 25, 2002 1:42 PM
http://www.census.gov/prod/cen2000/dp1/2kh00.pdf

Sounds like whites are under-represented.
Where have you gone Louis Farrakhan?Wayne
Oct 24, 2002 11:03 AM
The CIA gave him cancer. I think it scared him. He's been rather quiet as of late.
White guy? I want to know what happened to the white van.Sintesi
Oct 24, 2002 11:12 AM
Somebody was slipping those cops some bad info. Everyone was so focused on the van those guys must have felt invisible.
Maybe the cops were slipping us bad info too? It happens. nmsn69
Oct 24, 2002 11:14 AM
The legend of the cream-coloured Camaro.RoyGBiv
Oct 24, 2002 11:38 AM
In the early nineties, there was a horrible crime wave up here in southern Ontario. Young girls were abducted, raped and murdered. Perhaps you heard about it - the Bernardo case.
Early on, a witness swore he saw one of the girls being bundled into a cream-coloured Camaro. All summer, the public was asked to keep an eye out for a cream-coloured Camaro. The cops even put up billboards. There were police chases involving Camaros or Firebirds. Everytime you saw anything that resembled a cream-coloured Camaro, you checked out the driver.
When they finally caught up to Bernardo, what did they find in his garage? A gold-coloured Nissan.

Someone might have seen a white van running a red light moments after a shooting and then the power of suggestion took over.
I think there actually was...Wayne
Oct 24, 2002 11:39 AM
a description matching this car from one of the early shootings, but definitely the white van got all the media attention. It's looking more and more like this guys are the ones, I thought at first they may have just sold the sniper the weapon or were acting with him (them), but it's sounding like this is it.
might have been part of their MOColnagoFE
Oct 24, 2002 12:14 PM
I mean how logn do you think a killer would have to wait to see a white van with a ladder coming by...then find a random victim and pull the trigger...making it seem like the white vans were connected.
Until he talked to the police I assumed he was Al Quaeda ...fbg111
Oct 24, 2002 4:43 PM
... terrorist. It was a diabolically clever plan. Shoot peoople in a crowded metropolitan area without leaving a single lead or clue, scaring the hell out of several million people with only a car and 13 bullets. However, a true terrorist would never have bothered talking to the police, knowing that would be the quickest way of helping them find him, and having no need for extorting $10 million. Once the phone calls and extortions started, that didn't make much sense for someone whose only goal is to wreck as much death and havoc as possible before their death.
Evil is an equal opportunity employer (nm)Jon Billheimer
Oct 24, 2002 5:15 PM