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Let the market decide! Leave both formats open, and see...(20 posts)

Let the market decide! Leave both formats open, and see...Cory
Feb 5, 2004 9:08 AM
...which one survives.
I just came back here after trying the new one for a couple of days. Even for an admitted Luddite, it's hard to see a reason for the change.
It's awful.OldEdScott
Feb 5, 2004 9:16 AM
I grudgingly accept that there are technical reasons, invisible to us, that RBR has to dump this old software. But it's hard for me to believe there isn't better replacement software out there than that unreadable, unnavigable piece crap they chose.
I thought Gregg's team wrote their own forum software?kenyee
Feb 5, 2004 10:56 AM
The old one was written using ASP.Net and was probably a resource hog like most MS software ;-)

I thought the new one was a copy of the PHP forum that you see everywhere, but it turns out it really is that crappy PHP forum you see everywhere if you look at the URL. The PHP forum is supposed to be really fast, but I hate all that wasted whitespace and it's horribly ugly and hard to watch threads. What bugs me is everyone is trying to copy this PHP look, but it bites IMHO...


p.s., commented on it on the feedback forum for the new forum software too...
Old forum was not developed in house.gregg
Feb 5, 2004 2:16 PM
The main RoadBikeReview site is on .NET

The forums is actually an old system that is running on unix.

Well there really is not any other software out there!DIRT BOY
Feb 5, 2004 11:02 AM
It seems like everyone is going to this PHP Based FreeWare or Open-Source software. I had this type of board on my site and it sucked and failed.

So I hired a software engineer to create a board very similar to MTBR and RBR uses now. He said "It was easy" and good be done fast. The message board will be up and running any day now:

I just don't know why Consumer Review could not do the same.

Largest Gallery of Light Weight Bikes
You might want to look at your site in Mozilla ;-)kenyee
Feb 5, 2004 12:56 PM
Pretty garbled looking...looks like bad CSS or layers :-)
We are not live yet. Still testing. Live on Monday (nm)DIRT BOY
Feb 5, 2004 1:22 PM
I agreeandy02
Feb 5, 2004 9:32 AM
I is almost impossible to get a question anwered in that kind of set up. This board will die or get a bunch of people flamming each other.
Go to non-cycling. I just posted a suggestion there. nmOldEdScott
Feb 5, 2004 9:45 AM
There is a reason why I stopped going to similar formats...eschelon
Feb 5, 2004 10:45 AM
and its simply the fact that I get to view a whole sh#t load of topics and quick/witty responses that people put in their responses without me having to read the whole thread from the start...many times, the reponses are a whole lot interesting to read or catch my attention more than the original thread. Hence this is why I have stayed on this site for so long. But I guarantee you, I am not alone here. Once the new format is in full effect, I won't bother reading the forums and will only frequent the bike gallery. Nothing lasts forever I guess.
Go toOldEdScott
Feb 5, 2004 11:01 AM

I've established a beach-head there. We're talking over.
LOL! But unlike Bush, I have a post-victory plan.

Just click on 'expand' once you get in a forum and you'll see everything all nice and threaded and visible. You'll see me and Cory too, in General Discussions.
Are you getting a commission for converting us or what? (nm)TJeanloz
Feb 5, 2004 12:19 PM
amen bro, need I say more? nmRealCyclopatic
Feb 5, 2004 12:20 PM
It's what you make of it, and hello! - - it's free! (nm)hrv
Feb 5, 2004 9:45 AM
Just stopping back in to say "I like it."terry b
Feb 5, 2004 10:56 AM
technology marches on, and if one would spend a bit understanding the new format, one would find it too has positives.

Reminds me a lot of the "free PC" program my company offered. Several decent Dell systems, choose as-is or pay for some upgrades. Tax protected too. You never heard so many complaints.
for somelaffeaux
Feb 5, 2004 11:29 AM
Gregg and Francis heard enough complaining from me when made the switch, so I'll not continue to blow my hot air.

However... after a solid of month of using the new style forms on, I stand by my original statement that the are far inferior to the old forums. I still post in one forum that is bookmarked so that I do not have to search for it. Once a thread has more than 20 or so responses I stop reading it, as it's too difficult to follow.
question for youTrogon
Feb 5, 2004 11:38 AM
purely hypothetical of course because we cannot turn back the hands of time but, if you had just discovered this forum, in this format, and had never been exposed to the older format, would you stay away because you don't like it?

I agree though, that it is not as simple and perhaps simplicity is really what people are complaining about. But, I do think it has some decent features, some things are easier to do (like managing images) and some are just different.
question for youlaffeaux
Feb 5, 2004 11:59 AM
The reason that I frequented RBR and MTBR was entirely the format. There are many other forums on the web (RideMonkey, Bicycling, DirtRag, etc.), and I opted not to use them because of their format. To answer your question, if I happened upon the site in the new format, no I would not participate.

I used to actively read and post in many MTBR forums. I now participate in one. The one that I do particiapte in, did not exist previously, and is definitely a niche forum. I guess a bonus of the new system, is there are more boards.
Let me try to explain this for all.sysop
Feb 5, 2004 2:14 PM
I have posted a response in the new forums to complaints about the new forums and by far, the number one complaint is the "threaded" forum view. We realize that this is a big issue to a lot of you, and all I can say is that I agree with you. When I first started looking at the new forum, I found it harder to read, too. I had gotten so use to the current version (as we all have), that I didn't like the new layout at first.

The way conversation flows in the new forums is different from the old way, and I can see why people can't scan as quick as before. Which is why we worked so hard to at least get the "Hybrid" display mode in the new forums. Is it the same? No. But it is closer than the stock Vbulletin linear mode.

What we have found is that the "way" conversation flows on the new board is different, and this difference is what takes a while to get used to. You will stop seeing people use (nm) and even subject lines altogether. One problem with the old board is that in the "view all" mode, you can't tell who is responding to who. But people got used to this, and by and by it's not a big deal any more. Because people got used to it.

All I'm saying is, give the new boards a chance. It may take a week, or it may take two weeks, or maybe three. But there are some strong advantages to the new board that will prove themselves. The feature of being able to edit your own posts, having a real profile now, being able to subscribe to the threads you post to, so you don't have to keep coming back to the boards to see if someone replies to you or not. These are but a few of the advantages.

Other features like avatars and signatures are extra features that people like, and if you don't like them, you don't have to use them.

The community here has always thrived for one reason. You. It's not what kind of forum software we use (for the recored, we've used two different systems before this one). It's not who runs the site. It's not how many reviews we have on the site. The community thrives here because you all come here and contribute and interact.

I know that some of you are not happy with the layout of the new forums, but I'm just asking you to give the new forums a fair chance and I think things will be as strong (or stronger) than before.

Now OldEdScott and Dirt-Boy, I have to say that I take offense at you guys trying to recruit users for another forum here in this forum. If people don't like our new forums, of course they are open to go to whatever forum they choose. But it's just not cool to come in here and say "hey, let's all leave here and use xxxxx forum." Gio, for as long as you've been with us on MTBR, and for as long as I've had personal contact with you, it saddens me to see you in here trying to migrate RBR users to your forum.

Thanks for reading this.

As always, I am open to email.

Let me try to explain this for all.al0
Feb 7, 2004 1:49 PM
The new forum is almost unreadable and one of the worst samples of this style. Compare its format with for example on forums (not byke-related, but this dosn't matter) - they have more or less the same style but mauch more readable and convinient.