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Spoke Patterns? Any good sites or opinions on the subject?(13 posts)

Spoke Patterns? Any good sites or opinions on the subject?JohnnyCat
Jan 30, 2004 6:25 PM
I have an infantial knowledge on spoke patterns and their pros/cons. Can somebody direct me towards some good websites. If you want you can express your knowledge/ opinion on the subject.
One other thing: Do these offset rear rims really make a positive difference. I realize it's to compensate the whole cog issue, but it still looks weird. Is the reasoning behind it unsymmetriacal(rim) + unsymmetrical(cog issue) = symmetrical(wheel), and therefore balanced. It just looks like the rim is more proned to fail and/or have a crappy ride.

Have any suggestions for spoke count and patterns? I'm 155, ride 5000mi a year. I somtimes ride agressive, but never do anything radical. The wheels will be used for everything including some races. I'd be ok with having the wheels trued every 2000mi if they are real speed demons, but I'd prefer bragging that I have a set of wheels that have never needed to be trued.

Thanks John
There's a reason so many wheels are built 3 crossChicago_Steve
Jan 30, 2004 6:48 PM
Because it works...

Here's some theory though...

http://www.stormpages.com/spokeanwheel/lacinggw.htm
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html

Proper tension and stress relief goes a long ways towards a bulletproof set of wheels. At your weight and mileage get some good rims (OP, DT Swiss, Aeroheads). If you can sacrifice a little weight for strength get a v-style rim like a Velocity Fusion, Sun Venus, or Mavic CXP series and build with some quality spokes (Revs, XL14's, or Maybe CX Rays if you want to get fancy).

Offset spoke beds help to equalize spoke tension on the rear wheel. The concept seems to make sense although the looks are a little strange.
Not sure I would throw the Venus rim into the "V" categoryB2
Jan 30, 2004 10:55 PM
Don't mean to be nit pickin', but thought someone might be interested in how some of the different rim profiles stack up against each other.

Not to scale, but you get the idea
Where'd you get those?pitt83
Jan 31, 2004 5:00 AM
Interested in the Mavic dimensions especially. Not from their website, I assume. If you've got the MA3 , I'd especiaaly like to know the ERD, braking surface and width please.
Mavic profiles were from ExcelB2
Jan 31, 2004 7:36 PM
They probably don't have one for the MA3 though since I don't believe they sell it any more.

From Damon Rinard Spocalc - the ERD is 607

Bryan
Not sure I would throw the Venus rim into the "V" categoryHeron Todd
Jan 31, 2004 8:35 AM
It looks like you got the Venus profile from the Sun website. Unfortunately, their site shows the wrong profile for the Venus. The profile shown is for the ME14. The Venus is actually 25 mm deep but is otherwise similar to the ME14.

Todd Kuzma
Heron Bicycles
LaSalle, IL 815-223-1776
http://www.heronbicycles.com
Yep - From the Sun Ringle websiteB2
Jan 31, 2004 7:38 PM
Thanks for the info Todd. Any idea what the real weight is??

You would think they would have correct info on their own products.

Bryan
Yep - From the Sun Ringle websiteHeron Todd
Feb 1, 2004 1:19 PM
I know that Sun claims 440g for the Venus. I just weighed some in the shop, but I can't recall the exact weight off of the top of my head. I'm at home right now, and my weight list is at the shop. They were somewhere in the 450-460g range if I recall correctly.

It's been interesting the past few months playing with my new digital scale. A lot of items weigh exactly what the manufacturers claim while others are quite a bit different. I hope to get the list up on our website soon.

Todd Kuzma
Heron Bicycles
Tullio's Big Dog Cyclery
LaSalle, IL
http://www.heronbicycles.com/
http://www.tullios.com/
That sounds right...Steve-O
Feb 2, 2004 6:28 AM
I was talking with Mike Garcia of Oddsandendos.com comparing the Venus with the Velocity Fusion. He said the Venus was slightly lighter then the Fusions (Fusions normally at 470 - 480gms).
Sun Rim WeightsHeron Todd
Feb 2, 2004 11:49 AM
I weighed the Venus rims at 452g vs. the claimed 440g. A pretty small difference really. The claimed weight of the CR18 (700C) is 484g, but I weighed that one at 541g!

Todd Kuzma
Heron Bicycles
Tullio's Big Dog Cyclery
LaSalle, IL 815-223-1776
http://www.heronbicycles.com
http://www.tullios.com
if you skim through sheldon's pagecyclopathic
Jan 31, 2004 3:31 PM
you'd find he advocates for half radial/heads out rear as stronger alternative to conventional x3.

with respect to original question about offset rims yes, they help to reduce dishing. On Shimano rear hubs left side offset more then left by more then 2 times, even as little as 2-2.5mm reduces misbalance by 25%.
Don't be rediculousWoof the dog
Feb 1, 2004 11:37 PM
2 x is better, and as much as I asked, no one has ever come up with a good viable reason for why I should build 3x instead of 2x.

woof
Are there any websites that have pictures of each pattern?JohnnyCat
Feb 2, 2004 7:16 AM
How do you lace 2x as opposed to 3x? I realize its how many times a spoke crosses other spokes, but I still can't visualize how it is achieved. I need good close-up pics of the hub/rim.

Thanks