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Decsions, decsions...which frame: Lyon or Soma? Advice sough(11 posts)

Decsions, decsions...which frame: Lyon or Soma? Advice soughSkidoo
Jan 18, 2004 12:34 PM
Hello all -
I'm looking to build up an 'all-rounder' bike that is capable of brevets, light road touring with a BOB trailer and/or panniers, and even fast group rides. I've narrowed down my frame choices between the Soma Doublecross and the Lyon Rogue Special. Are these the best bikes in my price range of ~$750?

The Soma Doublecross is a Reynolds 631 cyclocross frame with canti brakes, rack and fender eyelets and a cro-mo fork.

The Lyon Rogue is a Reynolds 725 Sport-Tourer with long-reach dual pivot brakes, rack and fender eylets and a c/f fork.

My questions are: which frameset is constructed of better material? Will I sacrifice significantly better braking power when riding with trailer/panniers if I opt for the dual-pivot bike? On the other hand, will I sacrifice some handling or comfort if I opt for the Soma Doublecross and its higher bottom bracket? Anything else that I should consider?

Thanks!
Mike
I'm also after an all-rounder.Frith
Jan 18, 2004 1:02 PM
I originally was looking at different cyclocross frames as I'd heard much praise about they're ability to do alot of different things. I was looking at the doublecross along with the surly crosscheck. But then I started thinking that the only thing I DON'T need this bike to do is cyclocross so why would I consider a cross bike? What I also don't need is a full on touring bike that handles like a boat and encourages me to carry more weight than necessary.
I started re-focusing in the direction of sport tourer. I'm currently leaning heavily in the direction of the Marinoni Ciclo. I can have it w/ custom geometry/paint for about $700 Canadian (that's frame + fork). I know that Marinoni has a rep as an exceptional builder, so I'm pretty confident there. My ability to translate exactly what I want through the LBS is where my confidence wanes a little.
I hadn't looked yet at the Lyon. Where are you thinking of getting it from? online? I require pretty much the same thing as you... A bike that can be a light tourer and a fast commuter/group ride/century bike all at the same time. I'll definitely be following this thread.
I'm also after an all-rounder.Skidoo
Jan 19, 2004 10:15 AM
Frith -
We're on the same page in terms of what we are looking for from our next bike. I was leaning towards a cross bike for the same reasons but will probably never use it to actually race 'cross.
The Surly is totally out of the picture b/c of the tank-like handling and the tank-like weight (I mean, sheesh, could they have made that thing any heavier?)
The sport-tourer option is good, but I've heard so many people advocate for canti-brakes because of the extra stopping power they offer when loaded with a trailer and/or panniers. (Not that I'm gonna be hauling around the kitchen sink on this thing, anyway). I want a responsive rig that can handle weekend tours and multi-day rambles.

The Lyon Rogue is starting to sound like the best option (I was looking to get it from GVH Bikes.com since he has two Lyon frames in my size)

As the other poster said, the Curtlo is also a possibility.
I'll keep you posted on what I decide.
brakes and stuffFrith
Jan 19, 2004 4:27 PM
I think the standard longreach brakes would be fine for stopping power under any load you could comfortably get away with on most sport tour type bikes. The issue would be when you decide to use that trailer. The trailer adds the weight of itself (of course :-) and also by it's very nature encourages you to carry a heavier load.
When I resigned myself to the fact that a sport-tour type bike was the way to go I, at the same time, decided that any touring I did would be under an essentials-only strict lightweight philosophy. I have been part of a somewhat cult-like lightweight camping movement and I think I can carry some of those techniques over to the bike for some unsupported-type tours. Mostly though it will be a wallet and change of clothes type trips.
I was thinking of getting canti mounts on the marinoni anyway. That would be an option available with a custom build. I could get a bit of extra tire clearance this way and parts would be fairly easy to come by.
gear and stuffSkidoo
Jan 19, 2004 5:52 PM
Yer right, maybe I'm overdoing this anyway.
I've only just recently gotten bitten by the bike touring/brevet bug. I've only done one multi-day tour and a couple of o'ernight trips, so I want to make sure that I get the right bike for my intensions.
I got the trailer before I knew anything about touring, and it is an open invitation to overpack.
I'm thinking of sticking w/panniers now.

On a related note, what, in your estimation constitutes ultra-light weight camping? I thought I was being conservative with a single person tent in the balmy Midwestern spring & summer months, but I guess I could get by with just the fly & poles...its all about what you can endure and still be comfy, I guess.
oh man don't get me started.Frith
Jan 19, 2004 8:44 PM
It's almost a religion. To start with I use a henessey hammock. 2lbs vs. 3-5lbs for an expensive tent vs. 7lbs for a department store version. I could go on at length about the hammock alone.. It keeps me dry comfortable and all i need is a couple of trees.
Stoves. a home made achohol burning stove can save lots of weight over conventional white gas or canister stoves. The great thing about it is it's generally a cheaper way to go. Alot of focus is placed on simplicity, homemade gear and double usage of gear. Grams here and there add up big time, so you really have to be ruthless.
There's a yahoo group called backpackinglight where you can read more than you'll ever need to know. Like I say it's a bit of an obsession/cult thing and everyone has their own techniques.
check out www.hikinghq.com .. I happen to agree with alot of the way this guy approaches it. I like his scientific approach.
probably more info than you needed ;)
but if you ever need any more....
jsimpson AT operamail DOT com
let me know which way you end up going with the bike.
I got a used, steel Marinoni this winter.dzrider
Jan 19, 2004 12:50 PM
I've had a Reynolds 853 Lyon for 3 seasons. The Lyon serves incredibly well for all kinds of riding. It's light and lively enough for quick shop rides and the long wheel base and low bottom bracket make it comfy enough for Brevets. I've never owned a bike that both smooths and holds the road so well. I enjoy it greatly each time I ride it.

The Marinoni is columbus SL and looks like mid 80's crit geometry. It handles more nimbly and kind of shrugs off bumps that the Lyon glides over. I've yet to try it on a long ride, but I think it would work well. I also have no doubt that Marinoni could build an excellent sport-touring bike.
last winterFrith
Jan 19, 2004 4:36 PM
I got a Marinoni frame on ebay after falling in love with it. same era and tubeset as yours but has never been ridden. It's got classic italian type geometry and a beautifull metalic emerald green paint job. Custom emblamed lugs and chrome fork and stays too :-) I'm finally getting the parts together to build it up. It'll be a fixed gear sunday ride type bike because i couldn't bare to put it through the treatment some of my other bikes get :-).
The Marinoni sport-tour will no doubt be a nice bike but nothing approaching the beauty of "May" (that's her name :-)
Another possibilityAndy M-S
Jan 18, 2004 2:29 PM
Hey, can you beat a $300 frameset that includes brakes and shipping? If not, take a look at my Kogswell Komplete post, below.
re: Decsions, decsions...which frame: Lyon or Soma? Advice soughjrm
Jan 18, 2004 3:11 PM
The Soma stuff is kinda cool.love that burnt orange paint. The one thing that i didnt like abou the soma, and Surly was the sluggish steering from the slack head tube angle combined with a 43 degree raked steel fork. On the trail the bike handled great with big knobbies but on the road it was real slow and unresponsive. The ride was compliant but any thing but repsonsive. in comparison to better materials.

There are builders out there that will build you a frame for $ 750. It may not include a fork but youll get good tubing and the geometry and accesories you want. Give Curtlo a call and see what they can do for ya.
re: Decsions, decsions...which frame: Lyon or Soma? Advice soughB2
Jan 18, 2004 3:30 PM
I've got a Double Cross that I've used as a commuter for the last year or two. I'd have to agree with the other posters comments on the road hanlding. If you think this is what you're looking for I would be willing to sell it "cheap". It's a 56cm c-t (sloping TT) that is closer to a 58cm using conventional level TT c-t measurement. Email me at thrmlr AT yahoo DOT com if you're interested.

Bryan