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Ebay bidding sham?(16 posts)

Ebay bidding sham?Starliner
Sep 27, 2003 9:05 AM
A, B, and C have entered bids in the days and hours prior to the close of the auction. With seconds to go, D enters bid at an amount higher than current bid.

But wait, suddenly a phantom bid materializes, a bid which was placed by X several days earlier, and X wins the auction.

What gives? How can I learn how to place these phantom bids which don't show up until the end, so I can keep the bidding from getting too competitive?
Ah, but the real question is...fasteddie
Sep 27, 2003 9:18 AM
why has (psychic22) changed their eBay ID? What shenanigans has this person pulled in the past and they feel compelled to hide from???
Very simple.....Giant_Tom
Sep 27, 2003 9:57 AM
eBay has had a policy of not allowing email addys for id's for awhile but there was a grace period that is now ending and all users have had to change. If the user does not eBay does and it will be something like "member123456". Psychic22's old id was their email addy.
Ebay sellers bewareStarliner
Sep 27, 2003 11:32 AM
If I was that seller, I would consider voiding the auction. I don't think there is any provision for secret bids that are held back until the last moment. That kind of crap holds the final price down.
Ebay sellers bewareGiant_Tom
Sep 27, 2003 11:40 AM
Which one is the "secret" bid?? Obviously sweety3210 placed a proxy bid on the 22nd that was higher than any of the other bids could match.


User ID Bid Amount Date of Bid
sweety3210( 1 ) $20.43 Sep-22-03 23:12:32 PDT
psychic22( 60) $19.93 Sep-27-03 09:33:34 PDT
fozzy0_3( 1 ) $16.00 Sep-26-03 21:54:34 PDT
rossman56( 9 ) $14.76 Sep-26-03 14:32:42 PDT
rossman56( 9 ) $13.75 Sep-26-03 14:32:19 PDT
rossman56( 9 ) $10.25 Sep-26-03 14:32:02 PDT
rossman56( 9 ) $9.00 Sep-26-03 14:31:41 PDT
brownie_three( 1 ) $5.10 Sep-24-03 11:06:43 PDT
brownie_three( 1 ) $3.25 Sep-21-03 09:33:06 PDT
brownie_three( 1 ) $1.25 Sep-21-03 08:59:02 PDT
Sep 27, 2003 8:39 PM
That's no proxy bid. If is was, Sweetie's bid would have shown up on the auction 5 days before it did, like all other proxy bids do. Then it would have automatically strung along until the max bid amount was passed.

No, there's some other explanation - maybe a system failure.... or maybe a sudden bidding policy change ..... or maybe some ebay executive bent the rules to let some sweetie he knows win......?
Secret bid?filtersweep
Sep 27, 2003 11:48 AM
Have you any idea how ebay works?
Secret bid?Starliner
Sep 27, 2003 5:31 PM
I'm not familiar with days old bids from totally new bidders that don't show up until the very end - is that what a proxy bid is? Sound like a good way to water down the bidding process, I'll have to study up on that -
That ain't no proxy bidStarliner
Sep 27, 2003 6:16 PM
Well, I just checked the rules for proxy bidding - that wasn't a proxy bid.

Proxy bidding is when one makes a maximum bid at a price level higher than the current bidding price, and then ebay will place bids on your behalf as other bids come in, using only as much of your bid as is necessary to maintain your high bid position (or to meet the reserve price). Ebay will continue bidding up to your maximum bid amount. If another bid exceeds your max bid amount, you'll then be outbid, and forced to submit another bid.

Proxy bidding just means you don't have to continually go back to rebid. It's a common practice which I use all the time.

This wasn't a proxy bid - it was an unfair phantom bid that came out of left field. If this is the way they're going to operate, they might as well start folding up their tent, because who is going to want to sell something of value on a site that hides high bids until the end - thereby keeping a lid on the bidding process.
Sniping! nmdavet
Sep 27, 2003 8:41 PM
That ain't no proxy bidfiltersweep
Sep 28, 2003 4:54 AM
You realize that bids are listed in descending order by AMOUNT of bid- not by the time placed. The highest bid always wins no matter when it was placed.

It seems like there is no confusion regarding proxy bidding...

How did you obtain your information about the original three bidders? Were you a buyer or seller?

I've never had trouble with ebay in this manner.
Secret bidding is different from proxy bidsStarliner
Sep 28, 2003 10:36 AM
Here's how I understand how bidding works:

i (an imaginary example)

DATE: Five days before the close of the auction
CURRENT BID AMT: $10.50 (The next bid amount must be $11.00+)

Bidder X places a bid with a relatively high maximum amount of $25.00.

i What should happen next is this:

X's bid is entered into the auction; the current bid amount becomes $11.00; bidder X's transaction is listed in "bid history".

Any subsequent bids in the five days remaining will have to top $25.00 in order to become the highest bid. And all subsequent bidders are notified if an earlier bid has been made that is higher than their own bid.

i What happened in this auction was this:

X's bid was not put into the auction the time it was made. Bidding stayed well under X's maximum bid up until the final seconds of the auction, when suddenly X's bid appears. Without any time left to counterbid, X wins the auction at an amount several dollars less than X was willing to pay.

* * *

This kind of bidding practice is bad for sellers because it holds down the eventual selling price. One or more of the other bidders who might have tried to exceed bidder X's maximum had no time to counterbid as they normally should have had.

And this is bad for bidders because the bidding process becomes a waste of time and effort. Secret bidding, which is what happened here, is not the same as having a sealed bid, which is what proxy bidding resembles. It's unfair and could kill the whole thing.

Anybody from Ebay out there who can offer up an explanation?
NO such thing as "secret" biddingdesertmd
Sep 28, 2003 4:03 PM
Bids are dated and timed according to the when they were entered, and then proxy bidding takes over from there. Obviously the person who won the above auction bid an amount that was higher than what other people wanted to pay. That person only bidded once - and that was enough as proxy bidding took over from there - and would have kept going up to the winner's maximum bid. Seriously - ebay could work no other way, and the notion of scret bidding is silly.
Can you explain why a bid placed on the 22nd...BowWow
Sep 28, 2003 5:22 PM
didn't show up until the 27th? Is this a function of having the highest proxy bid? I would have thought that sweetie would have appeared as the high bidder every time a bid was placed. Perhaps that is the case, that sweetie stayed on the top of the list as the bidding occured, and we are only seeing the final result.

That could explain why brownie has the three lowest bids - she obviously wasn't bidding against herself... I am interested in what happened between 9:00 and 9:30 on the 21st, however. There is no other bidder listed that bid on the 21st. We see sweetie bidding on the 22nd, and all subsequent bids were outbid by her, automatically pushing her up each time a bid was placed. But who is the mysterious bidder that bid against brownie between 9 and 9:30 on the 21st of September?!!!

Sep 28, 2003 6:23 PM
"But who is the mysterious bidder that bid against brownie between 9 and 9:30 on the 21st of September?!!!"

Brownie did. My brother is guilty of this also. Place a bid, change mind as to amount, go in bid again with a higher amount thinking it's high enough to win. People bid against themselves all the time but all it does is introduce a proxy amount instead of actually raising the bid price.
Sep 29, 2003 6:19 AM
the earlier bid should still show in the chronology of it all. I'm very familiar with proxy bidding but this has me puzzled.