|Requesting Advise on Fuji Team Superlight||CDH|
Sep 22, 2003 9:06 AM
|I've been riding one year and particpate in weekly fast club rides, centuries and annual LOTOJA. Currently ride an Aluminum frame with Carbon Seat Stay/fork. Looking for a lighter climbing/quicker ride. I noticed a great deal on the Fuji Team Superlight w/Ultegra/American Wheelsmith/FSA Carbon compact cranks (50/34 ?)...sub 16lbs. Any inputs/reccomendations would be appreciated.
|re: Requesting Advise on Fuji Team Superlight||biknben|
Sep 22, 2003 9:51 AM
|Fuji offers some very competitive deals on most of their bikes. The Superlight is Fuji's attempt at a low weight/reasonable cost bike. The compact crank shaves some grams without any additional cost. Keep in mind, that weight probably doesn't include pedals.
Does this really offer considerable weight savings over your current bike? Unless it is a real budget frame, you may not see significant difference.
|re: Requesting Advise on Fuji Team Superlight||CDH|
Sep 22, 2003 1:09 PM
|The Fuji website lists a 56cm at 15lbs...w/out pedals. Sounds inaccurate. My current bike is probably 18 lbs w/speedplays (cosmics and triple ultegra). Not sure if the weight savings is significant enough to justify the price. Other alternative is to replace my wheels with Rolf Prima Vigor or Ksyriums...any thoughts? I climb frequently and weigh around 158lbs at 6' tall.
Thanks again for the input!
|Let me tell you a story about this guy I know (me)...||biknben|
Sep 22, 2003 4:36 PM
|I used to be overweight by roadie racin' standards. I went up to 210 lbs before I saw the light and dumped the excess. I got myself down to 155. At 6' tall this was as low as my body would go. The process of losing all the weight turned me into a total weight weenie. I rewarded myself for the diet by going out and building the lightest bike I could afford. It ended up being just over 15 lbs complete. Coming from a 10 YO Fuji Roubaix steel rig that weighed over 23 lbs, the difference was huge. Now, two years later, I have realized that there is a big trade-off between weight and durability. I have had to replace some really pricey sh!t because it just wouldn't hold up. I'm still a weight weenie but I'm a little more sensible.
All the stuff you have now is medium grade stuff. Ultegra with Cosmics on an avg. Al frame. Every component on your bike has a lighter replacement out there if you want to drive yourself crazy. Unfortunately, each replacement is costly and only produces small gains. You can start over, blow the bank and maybe save 3 lbs. OTOH, you could replace a couple smaller items and save a little weight here or there. Trust me, you end up blowing the bank either way.
If you think you need an upgrade, the fuji is a good deal, and you have the cash then you may justify getting yourself a new bike. If your on the fence about any of these things than I recommend you put your wallet away and keep riding what you have. You're friends aren't faster because of their bikes.
|won't help your speed...||C-40|
Sep 22, 2003 10:20 AM
|The desire to have a lighter bike is posted frequently on this site. If you already have an Al/carbon frame, it can't be much heavier than the one you are considering, perhaps .5 pound in the frame and another fraction of a pound on the components.
Saving one pound will not produce any measureable speed gain or perceptible reduction in climbing effort. For a typical 180 pound rider & bike, it's will produce a .5% improvement only on the climbs. On the flats it is of no value and it reduces speed on a descent (you can't have your cake and it too). The net improvement on a loop ride (starting and returning at the same place) is likely to be zero.
If you want to spend a bunch of money, upgrade to a 10 speed bike (Campy or Shimano). 9 speed is on the way out.
Also note that when you use a 50/34 crankset, you must use a 11T cog to get the same top gear ratio as a 53/12. If you need the lower gear for climbing, that's fine, but you will either sacrifice top speed unless you're willing to live with the wide cog spacing that you get with a 9 speed cassette and an 11T top cog. Once again, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
|won't help your speed...||CDH|
Sep 22, 2003 1:29 PM
|Thanks for the advise. Weight savings could be 3 lbs, if the Fuji site listing is accurate (56cm = 15lbs). I weigh around 158lbs and could ride the American Wheelsmith wheels on the Fuji no problem. Your insite on the 50/34 is helpful. I do not push my 52x12 to the extreme often and would be happy to spin a 50x12...I'm 44 and rarely race (cat 5/Master). Most of my rides are fast club rides or training loops (either mountain/canyon climbs or flat/minor hills). All my riding friends are purchasing lightweight Trek's/Giant's/Bianchi's and I thought this would be a less costly alternative. I've considered buying new wheels...any thoughts on Rolf Prima Vigor's or Kysrium's? Also, do you know a website that explains gear ratios/options? Thanks again!|
|weight is not accurate....||C-40|
Sep 22, 2003 2:06 PM
|I think the Fuji guys are full of baloney. The difference in weight between a real cheap aluminum frame and a "ultralight aluminum" is only 1.5lbs (3.5 vs. 2). With the same components, an ordinary Al framed bike will be not more than 1.5 lbs heavier than ultralight aluminum.
I ride a Colnago C-40 carbon fiber frame with Campy Record groupo and either Ksyriums or Campy Eurus wheels. I have a light Selle Italia SLK saddle, 125 gram Ritchey stem, Colnago carbon seatpost, Easton carbon handlebars and speedplay pedals. All some of the lightest components available. The complete bike weighs somewhere between 16 & 17 lbs. with bottle cages and a computer. There is no way that it's close to 15.
If you do save three pounds and think you can feel the difference, it's purely your imagination. A 1.5% change is simply not noticeable. I only weigh 131 right now. The 5 pounds that I've dropped has not resulted in any miraculous improvement in my climbing ability. Losing weight off the body is exactly the same as having a lighter frame.
|weight is not accurate....||CDH|
Sep 22, 2003 2:35 PM
|Agreed that the weight listing is definitely inaccurate and that the bike is 16+lbs. It is difficult to measure the benefits of weight loss (bike/body). But everyone is going lighter (wheels/stems/bars/etc.) My own experience has been there is a definite benefit for climbing (I've lost 25lbs this year and I wasn't exactly overweight) and endurance. Although, training is most important. Thanks for the input...still not sure what to do. If only I could talk my wife into letting me purchase a C-40 (so beautiful)!! I do love the Speedplays though...ride safe. Thanks!|
|25lbs is a big benefit...||C-40|
Sep 22, 2003 3:26 PM
|About ten times the benefit of that lighter bike. Seriously, if you can pinch a bit of fat anywhere, there is almost always more to be lost from the body than you could ever lose on the bike.
Also on a serious note, compare the complete price of your bargain bike to the $1000 cost for an upgraded Ultegra build kit, or the $1300 for a DuraAce build kit. The rest is the price of the frame & fork. I haven't bought a factory built bike in over 10 years, because I always ended up changing out the saddle, stem, bars, tires and maybe the wheels for something I liked better. With a custom build you can get every part to your liking.
If you want a nice ultralight Al frame, take a look at www.fondriest-usa.com. They have some great discounts on high-end frames. The weld finishing and paint on these frames is excellent, at a fraction of the price of a C-40 (that's why I bought one!).
Sep 22, 2003 3:49 PM
|I think there's a difference between body weight, which moves around with you, and the dead weight of a bike.
Just for example, if someone loses 10 lbs, some of it will be fat and some might be muscle. This creates a trade-off. He's losing a couple pounds of meat that was serving a useful cycling function. It was producing force on the pedals, helping him propel himself up the hill. So he's lost weight, but he has less power to move the weight.
But when someone switches to a lighter bike, the weight savings has no trade-off. (other than long-term durability)
The rider gets to keep the muscle and still be hauling less weight up the hill. He has the same power, AND less weight to move.
Granted, this probably isn't the case here.
|only a moron....||C-40|
Sep 22, 2003 4:48 PM
|If you're actively training and too stupid to eat properly you might lose muscle, but for anyone with any brains, fat will be lost fat and muscle gained, not lost. Muscle will only be sacrificed if nutritional requirements and the body has no fat left. Elite athletes run this risk when they get under 5% body fat. The average guy who thinks he's lean usually has at least 10% body fat and 10 pounds he could shed.
For example, a large pro rider at 6' height will weigh in at 155-170. Small guys like me go under 130. Even at 131. I've got several more pounds I could lose to reach less than 5% body fat.
For all practical puroses, hauling your fat ass up a mountain isn't any different than hauling up a really heavy frame. The improvment with a light frame is still way less than 1% in most cases.
Sep 22, 2003 6:42 PM
|How much weight has he lost since switching from track to road? Is all that lost weight fat? Did he lose any muscle? Was he too stupid to eat properly?|
|what about him???||C-40|
Sep 22, 2003 8:27 PM
|I'm sure Marty lost a bunch of muscle weight and IMPROVED his ability to climb due to the lower body weight. You made the contention that losing muscle weight would decrease your climbing ability. Give me a good example please. This one seems backwards.
I always like to see a heavily muscled guy try to climb. I've never encountered one that I couldn't run circles around. It's all about (sustained) power to weight ratio. Heavily muscled guys generally produce a lot of power for a very short time. Not worth a damn on a climb that takes an hour to complete.
|YES... weight is not accurate||kneebreaker|
Sep 22, 2003 10:20 PM
|i agree. i went to performance today to buy some goods when i saw the superlight hangin. i asked to pick it up. salesman said it was under 16lb. i then picked up a giant with a claimed weight of 18.7lb. they both fealt the same. i am very good when it comes to weight.
may i suggest anyone before they buy a bike that sounds too good to be true, ask the salesperson if they have a scale. weight it and let us know what it really was.
|YES... weight is not accurate||CDH|
Sep 23, 2003 7:41 AM
|There is a Fuji dealer within a couple hours, I'll check it out. To all, Thanks for the advise! Excellent input.|| |