|Any East Indians Among Us?||2300 Edmontonian|
Jun 25, 2003 3:21 PM
|Does this make me the only person to be from the Indian subcontinent?.. WoooooooooohOOOOOOOOOOO!!
Maybe I should wait for replies...
I might be 17 and therefore may not have a lot to distiunguish, but what are you/have you done which you can proudly say is unique to yourself!
|yes there are a few (nm)||nn23|
Jun 25, 2003 5:28 PM
Jun 25, 2003 6:42 PM
|please dont take this wrong, but why the f*ck are you asking this? why do you care?
I see this a fair amount on messageboards "are there any Amenians in here?" "yo yo koreans shout-out!", etc..
I probably shouldnt mention that im a white middle class male between the ages of 18 and 30, but I thought people kept up the fight to make race be indistinguishable.
The real question I have is just what do you ("you" being any member of some non-white group calling attention to their non-whiteness in an attempt to "distinguish" themselves) want?
Do you want me to treat you like everyone else? Or do you want me to treat you like an East Indian? Pick one, please.
|Ah, come on Collinsc...||crosscut|
Jun 25, 2003 7:05 PM
|Relax, friend. Every ethnic entity in a minority status will seek out his or her own kind. That's just human and animal nature. Surely you know that. If you found yourself in India for some reason, you would seek out whites who share your values and skin. Wouldn't you? So be fair, now, to our biking friend from India. He's just looking for someone to relate to, that's all. Though America is the "great social experiment" and tolerance amongst the diverse races held as an ideal, it doesn't preclude we can't hang with those we are most comfortable with. In this forum, we're all bike enthusiasts, but it would be cool if I were from India (or anywhere else) if I could find someone I could communicate about biking with. Don't take this the wrong way, Collinsc, I just thought you were a little too critical about something the poster never intended.|
|Ah, come on Collinsc...||collinsc|
Jun 25, 2003 7:23 PM
|yeah, youre right sure, but it seems like a stupid thing to do on an internet forum. If I chimed in and said i was Indian would he feel more welcome even though it was a lie?
But on one point, no I wouldnt seek out white people. I wouldnt seek out any people. I generally dont like company and find most people either offensive or uninteresting, but this insight is probably why these little things get on my nerves.
I think what bothers me about these sorts of inquiries are that they seem to undermine an otherwise open and welcoming environment, implying that something is missing or wrong.
You are right though, I need to relax.
Jun 25, 2003 8:36 PM
|Yes this is a country where we tolerate differences to get along. I've been in N.America for three years now, and now as I graduate in the end of grade 12, I am the president of my school, you know why?, cause people don't discriminate, and everyone and every background gets together. So I'm definately DEFINATELY not trying to distinguish between differences, cause I do understand the value and there is my example.
If you go somewhere, and if someone tells you that they are a road cyclist just like yourself, won't you be more attracted to him.. isn't this how friends are made?, commonalities, I see posts all the time of people from different areas seeking out others from the same area just so they can discuss experiences and feelings, this is what it was all merily all about..
Obviously I want to be treated like everyone else, but I want people to know of my background, cause that's who I am, where I grew up, and my morals and values come from. That doesn't mean I'll use it against anyone in any way negative you can think of. Where I live now is my home too, the values I gained here are important too, don't get me wrong. The oppurtunity to road bike, I can never have from where I come from.
And as far as the whole seeking out other east indians to feel welcome, I have no idea where that came from, my one year experience as a road cyclist has been so amazing, from the people at my LBS encouraging me, to here where they'll gladly answer any questions, even if you can search back and get the answers from a million threads just like the one I might discuss - I feel welcome enough already thankyou.
Why am I proud of it, because that's where I come from.. I'm as proud of being East Indian as I am of being a road cyclist and of being a north american.
I was thinking of starting a thread to see where people are from, cause I'm curious about other backgrounds and countries since I find that many people are ignorant towards my own (i'm actually from Pakistan not from India), I can only learn more about others so I'm not the same way myself. Forget that.
Awwwww man, as I write this, I can see so many things which anyone of you can pick out and critiscize me for,
Please don't take anything personally or negatively.. my intentions were never to distuinguish, understand that.
|Well said...no problems here||crosscut|
Jun 25, 2003 9:13 PM
|And good luck with you cycling. You know what's weird...I grew up in Southern Illinois, pretty much ignorant of the rest of the USA, let alone the rest of the world. 53 years later my best friend is Aftab Kahilli, an immigrant from Pakistan. We are engineers at a large brewery, he's Muslim, I'm an atheist.
Get out of high school (it sounds like you're on your way), get your act together for college, and get a professional career. You'll do well in America, then. Good luck with cycling and good luck with your life!
|I respect your views, collinsc...||crosscut|
Jun 25, 2003 9:01 PM
|but everyone is a little different in the social context. I guess I'm different than you in that I pretty much enjoy everyone, and I particularly enjoy folks who are different than me and those who I normally socialize with. But to each his own, and I respect that. As far as the impropriety of whether or not such a question belongs on this internet forum...well, why not? The poster just simply wanted to know if there were other fellow Indians who participated here. Again, a natural thing to do. I don't agree "these sort of inquires...undermine an otherwise open and welcoming environmet, implying something is missing or wrong." This forum is certainly open and welcoming, and we entertain all sorts of weird notions. I love it! It'd be pretty boring otherwise. I don't think there was any implication "something is missing or wrong." I think he was saying, "hey, any Indians out there?" Nothing wrong with that, in my view. Do you honestly think there is?|
|Ah, come on Collinsc...||weiwentg|
Jun 26, 2003 5:01 AM
|if you were in a foreign country, you'd probably do the same.
> generally dont like company and find most people either offensive or uninteresting
by now, this is pretty obvious.
|was wondering when you'd show up on this one nm||collinsc|
Jun 26, 2003 8:11 AM
|take up CX, bound to do wonders for your disposition :) (nm)||weiwentg|
Jun 26, 2003 8:48 AM
|I agree with your frustration.||eschelon|
Jun 26, 2003 6:01 AM
|I understand your frustration on this matter...minorities have to realize that you can't have it both ways...to live and be a member in a general society of one as opposed to also wanting the special distinction of being a minority. It's true that racial equality may never be attained unless all of the whites, asians, arabs, etc. inter-breed to destroy the race distinction...but alas, it is unlikely.|
|Why are you proud of being East Indian?....||Bruno S|
Jun 25, 2003 7:54 PM
|aren't there like 1 Billion people like you. Not very unique in my opinion.|
|real nice Bruno S - ignore this idiotic post (nm)||climbo|
Jun 26, 2003 3:32 AM
|Thank you, I have always excelled at political correctness. nm||Bruno S|
Jun 26, 2003 8:13 AM
|There are many Indians, but how many Indo-roadies in the states||JimboTero|
Jun 26, 2003 4:08 AM
|I don't know if there are alot or what, but no problem seeking out others of your kind !So what !? If you think race should be no problem then don't freak out if someone mentions it - as long as it's not negative. I say, be proud !|
|There are many Indians, but how many Indo-roadies in the states||joey2mak|
Jun 26, 2003 6:29 AM
|As for me, there is only one race... the HUMAN race.|
|if your statement were true,||weiwentg|
Jun 26, 2003 8:58 AM
|asking if there were any East Indian roadies would then be no different from asking if anyone on the board were from, say, Michigan. in fact, people have probably done that (just not with Michigan). no one ever got flamed for asking if there was anyone from some place in the CONUS. someone just got flamed for asking if there was anyone from East India. your attitude would normally be commendable but you seem to be ignoring some pretty glaring problems.|
|there is a bit of a difference between Michigan and India||collinsc|
Jun 26, 2003 9:47 AM
|the primary one being that people here are generally looking for other riders in their area to form groups. Being that the original poster is not currently in East India and he asked nothing about current location, I think it is fair to conclude the two requests are not at all similar.
If he were asking for East Indian riders in the Michigan area...well then I'd have a real issue instead of just a mild distaste.
|why distaste at all?||weiwentg|
Jun 26, 2003 10:53 AM
|all right, then ... British posters have asked if anyone from the Isles is on the board (this I remember clearly). I also remember (clearly) no one flaming them for it. if you were around then (this I can't remember) you said nothing. would you have?
you implied in your first post that you want everyone to be treated as indistinguishable. if so, then asking if there are any East Indian riders is no different than asking if there are any Michigan riders or any British ones.
do you have a problem with people "calling attention to their non-whiteness"? why is that a problem? why is your assuming that there are no differences between any of us - ie, that everyone is White - NOT a problem?
the original poster did not intend to insult anyone by "calling attention" to the differences between him and most of the people on this board. how you and some other people managed to construe this as an insult, I have absolutely no idea. you said that he was somehow implying, by asking his question, that something was missing or wrong on this forum. what's wrong is you taking offense over an innocent question.
and lastly, flyingbowlofmilk over on the racing board has stated that he is African-American and Native American. might have been before you were around, but that doesn't matter. you should go over to the racing board and flame him. no wonder he doesn't post on General...
that comment about taking up cyclocross was serious. despite the fact that most of them mainly ride road bikes, the CX crowd is not uptight at all.
|location vs heritage||collinsc|
Jun 26, 2003 12:25 PM
|Looking for riders from Michigan is nothing at all like looking for riders of a certain lineage. People look for other riders near their location to connect with them for rides. I said this in my last post and I guess you just glossed over it.
Looking for East Indian riders as is the subject here is not the same as looking for riders IN East India. So this guy is from Pakistan, living somewhere in N. America. So there are some other Pakistanis living somewhere else in N. America. What good does this knowledge do anyone?
Please please please read this post and realize that your point about Michigan is idiotic. Asking about location is very very different from asking about heritage. Read that sentence again if it didnt work the first time.
You said: "do you have a problem with people "calling attention to their non-whiteness"? why is that a problem? why is your assuming that there are no differences between any of us - ie, that everyone is White - NOT a problem? "
My original post asks this same question. What do you (again, "you" being anyone calling attention to race) want from me? Do you want to be treated the same as I treat everyone else? Or do you want to be treated like an ____(unicorn, carebear, whatever)?
You get to pick ONE of those. I am open to either option, but its up to you to decide. My problem is with people who cant decide. So you're asian? Ok, great, do you want me to treat you like an asian with some special asian-only protocol or do you want me to treat you like every other person on the street?
"how you and some other people managed to construe this as an insult, I have absolutely no idea. you said that he was somehow implying, by asking his question, that something was missing or wrong on this forum. what's wrong is you taking offense over an innocent question. "
I wouldnt say that I take offense at any of this. But I do question the motivation behind it. This is what I am attempting to draw attention to.
I have no idea why you brought FBM into this, I am well aware that he is what he is and I dont particularly care either. He doesnt draw attention to it, or look for special recognition because of it. If he were to do so however, I would probably have something to say, though I may bite my tongue as discussions like this usually go the wrong way quickly (as this one is seeming to do)
Lastly weiwentg, I believe we've been through this before. You and I never agree, I am certain we agreed to disagree over on Velonews a while back. Dont let this get personal.
|my point is this||weiwentg|
Jun 26, 2003 1:27 PM
|you know I'm Asian, and you know FBM is African/Native American. you treated neither of us any differently than any other cyclist on this board. I find your reason for a special exception in this case to be specious. are you uncomfortable dealing with people of East Indian ethnicity in particular? are there people on RBR uncomfortable with East Indians?
you think my point about being from MI vs India is bogus. why? the poster was not trying to instigate a flame war. the original poster wanted to find someone s/he could connect with on the basis of ethnicity. if you worked overseas, you would do the same - I see expatriates hang out together in my home country all the time, although they of course hang out with the locals as well. if you were from Michigan, you might be interested in knowing who is from that state. why is race/ethnicity suspect? I have to say (not going to pull punches here), it looks like the main answer is that it's suspect to White people. is race/ethnicity a serious threat to the integrity of the board? I didn't perceive a threat. presumably, most other people (Doug included) didn't. does it make it seem that the original poster chose not to assimilate into American culture? if so, is that necessarily bad (after all, the expatriates I know very, very rarely assimilate into Singaporean culture)?
and lastly, why is it that so many White people are often so uncomfortable dealing with any sort of issue that deals with race/ethnicity? if those people got over it, race/ethnicity wouldn't be such a big issue. imho.
side note, back in '01, someone got flamed for asking if there were any other Christian riders on the board. amazing stuff. I think I'll go ride my CX bike.
|what does it take, weiwentg?||collinsc|
Jun 26, 2003 4:08 PM
|Please dont try to paint me a racist: "are you uncomfortable dealing with people of East Indian ethnicity in particular?" Youre no psychologist (although you seem to try a lot), I hate everyone equally.
Had you come on and said "Any Singaporeans in here?" I would have had the same things to say. The Christian thing bugs me just the same.
I think your point about Michigan vs India is bogus (for the THIRD time) because people LIVING IN Michigan will search for other people LIVING IN Michigan for the general purpose of enjoying the sport of cycling as a group. There is no such connection between a Pakistani from New York and a Pakistani from California.
Also, again as it was suggested (and denied) before, I WOULD NOT search out people of my color, am simply not that sociable. Had I come here, looking, as you say, for someone to connect with on the basis of ethnicity, I would be quickly thrown off (hey, yeah, Im white.).
You are, as usual, reading too far into this. I'm hardly "so uncomfortable" dealing with issues of ethnicity, but I do, however, strongly wish there was no such thing as an "issue of ethnicity".
Now, I hope we're done. This is way too many words for something I think is so ridiculous in the first place.
|re: location vs heritage||2300 Edmontonian|
Jun 26, 2003 12:56 PM
|The main reason I mentioned locations (I don't know if it was picked up from my post or just randomly brought up) was to prove a point that people look for others who have the same interests, so they can share experiences, talk, all that.
Now, here's an example, JUST an example, I own a Trek 2300, what if I seek out other people with Trek 2300s just to discuss stuff related to it?, now we won't be riding together would we?, just sharing what we have in common.. this is exactly what my "motivation" which you question behind this post was,
I don't see how you would treat me any different if you treat me like an east indian,
This discussion is indeed going the wrong way..
Alex-In-Evanston, I have absolutely no idea what assam means,
|re: Any East Indians Among Us?||268generation|
Jun 26, 2003 9:56 AM
|Im 18 korean living in colorado. And yes i might be the only few asian biker where i live, but do i care or others ? no... we are all roadies here.
Who cares if youre east indies...
|Amen ! We are all just roadies !!||JimboTero|
Jun 26, 2003 8:12 PM
|OOP's I said "Amen" - Is anyone offended by that ? Oh my gosh ! The other guy said "white people". Maybe some is offended by this, too. Guys, get a grip !Who cares !! this is the whole problem in the U.S. these days -some members of the majority race ("whites" or "caucasians") get hyper sensitive and defensive about being accused of racism, minorities sometimes get paranoid, and it ends up spotlighting something that doesn't deserve the energy you've been giving it. This whole discussion is like a bucket of tar- don't stick your foot into it !Go ride your bikes instead. And for the Asian guy who said ..."you white people..," Don't attribute views to me that I don't share because of the color of my hide. I was born this way, oh well.I'd guess most of the posters who supported the original post by the East Indian guy where also "white". This is really a NON-issue. We roadies share more in common with each other than the couch potatos of our own genetic group.|
|By "East India", do you mean, like, Assam?||Alex-in-Evanston|
Jun 26, 2003 10:57 AM
|Do all Canadians refer to it that way?