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Milaneza's Perez and EPO: How stupid can you be?(12 posts)

Milaneza's Perez and EPO: How stupid can you be?philippec
May 28, 2003 5:24 AM
So now that there seems to be an explanation as to how Milaneza was able to dynamite the peleton in Romandie (and Paris-Nice perhaps as well), how many others are still up to "topping" up before races? How f!cking stupid can you be to still be using EPO (if you are still using anything!!). Sad to say but even though I'd like to believe that the sport is clean (well, it certainly seems cleaner!), I have stopped being surprised with every new controle positif. I just wonder if and when we will find out what new products others are using? The sad thing is that we will likely never know for sure -- and that makes getting excited about riders' victories that little bit harder, even for those riders who I would like to believe are still clean such as Hamilton, Armstrong, et al.

c'est la vie...

now back to getting excited about the races!

A+

Philippe
Laurent Roux got a 4 year suspension recently...eschelon
May 28, 2003 5:31 AM
As long as there is money involved in sports, there will always be athletes juicin'. The only sport that actively goes after cheating athletes is cycling. US baseball players are mostly juicin', football players are juicin', I wouldn't doubt it if the tennis players are juicin'...these other sporting bodies do not actively test their athletes like cycling does. Many of these other organizations usually have contractoral stipulations that informs athletes when or if they are going to get tested well in advance. Mark Mcguire is a juicer just like Sosa. Mark Mcguire used to be just another skinny ball player and then all of a sudden all I ever heard or seen on TV was this whole big hoopla about Mcguire and his hitting streak.
ok, let's at least make this fun...philippec
May 28, 2003 5:47 AM
I suggest we start a pool for "most likely cyclist to next be found out to be (or have been) doping..."

Nominees anyone?

I'll go with a safe bet on Milaneza's Claus Michael MÖLLER and (sigh....) Miguel Indurain.

and extra points for correctly naming the peleton's next drug of choice! (MD's are not eligible for this category -- but if any of you have an inside line, pls. let me know!)

A+

Philippe
Moller...Dwayne Barry
May 28, 2003 5:59 AM
doesn't he already have an EPO suspension in his past?
yes...andphilippec
May 28, 2003 6:04 AM
that's why its my "safe" bet. My runner-up sure-thing entry is Milaneza's Txlaxa(sp?) del Olmo (also dq'd for EPO use).

A+

Philippe
"wrong way" pereztarwheel
May 28, 2003 5:56 AM
I watched the Tour of Romandie coverage on OLN and couldn't believe how strong Perez was on the climbs. He's a big guy and just dropped the field on the big hills. I was impressed and really felt for the guy when he lost a sure win on one stage by making a wrong turn in the final kilometer. Now I'm not so sorry for him and feel he got what he deserved. Maybe EPO interferes with brain cells as well.
re: Milaneza's Perez and EPO: How stupid can you be?al0
May 28, 2003 7:22 AM
There is one problem - AFAIK EPO tests are not very reliable and don't allow to distinguish "abnormal" hemoglobin level that come from dope from the same level deservs to other reasons (e.g. intensive training in highlands,born pecularity, ...). So we may not be sure about are cyclist really guilt or now. BTW, I had abnormally high hemoglobin level at mid-70s (much,much higher then is considered suspicious for EPO tests) and this was long before EPO was invented (if I'm not wrong about date of his invention).

If some DM or other persons that have more precise knowledge concerning EPO testing can disprove my statement about unrealibility of EPO tests they are welcome.
Well...Dwayne Barry
May 28, 2003 8:14 AM
Perez didn't fail a hematocrit test (i.e. his wasn't above 50% which is the UCI limit) so they aren't trying to distinguish "abnormal" hemoglobin from "normal". There are two EPO tests, if I remember correctly, I think the one the UCI uses is the one that actually detects the metabolites of the drug. So it's only good for a few days post-injection.
Well...QuentinCassidy
May 28, 2003 10:13 AM
Yes, he's a dummy. What the hell was he thinking? EPO is only detectable for a couple of days, yet takes like 6 weeks to work (time needed for a red blood cell to mature). That's definitely not going to help him win Romandie. Was he getting ready for a surprise invite to the TdF? Moron!!! What was he taking EPO for anyway? That's like 10 year old technology. There's better stuff sold OTC just a few countries away. This is a direct result of a small team without the funds to 1) procure the right drugs and 2) hire a decent doctor to keep the kids from making these kind of mistakes.
wasn't there Escatel rider fail EPO test in TdFcyclopathic
May 28, 2003 10:42 AM
the test was successfully challenged as unreliable. There's ~20% error margin.

If Perez took EPO it is completely stupid. Barometric equipment to boost hematocrit count cost equiv of few month EPO supply.
re: Milaneza's Perez and EPO: How stupid can you be?purplepaul
May 28, 2003 3:27 PM
I guess I just don't understand why the testing isn't started weeks before the race starts and continued throughout. That would seem to ensure that there would be no opportunity to juice. It was mentioned last year on OLN that the doctor who developed the test for EPO said it wasn't being administered properly. For what possible reason would the governing body not change that?
re: Milaneza's Perez and EPO: How stupid can you be?QuentinCassidy
May 29, 2003 5:59 AM
First of all, I'm not sure they really want to catch riders. It nearly ruined the sport a few years ago just by examining the tip of the iceburg.

Plus it's easy to avoid. The way it works is that you're supposed to let the UCI know where you are at all times. If you're going to take a vacation for a weekend, you let them know where and when so they can come test you if they feel like it. Well, just lie. Check into a different hotel and lay low for a few days. By Monday you're "clean" and you head back to train with the team. This is why every single good TdF contender is not at any races now where they might be tested. They're hiding out all over Europe, or in some cases, Columbia (yeah, Botero had to go to Colombia to train... the mountains there are so much better and safer than the ones in Europe). Where were Tyler and Lance and Leipheimer last weekend? I don't know, and I doubt the UCI knew either. Where was Kalid 6 weeks before any of his 2:06 marathons? Maybe he was at home getting tested, but I don't think so. He was training in Mexico (there EPO is OTC), because Mexico is a lot better place to train than San Diego or Boulder.... right.