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Zipp 404's vs. Mavic Ksyrium SL's(13 posts)

Zipp 404's vs. Mavic Ksyrium SL'sColoradoRoadie
May 1, 2003 7:18 AM
I'm trying to decide between Zipp 404's and Ksyrium SL's.

Advantages of the Mavic's (as best I can tell):
I can get clinchers, and they don't weigh much more than the tubulars. They're significally less expensive than the Zipp's. I'd feel safe using them for training as well as racing.

Advantages of the Zipp's
One of the lightest wheels around. Very aerodynamic. They turn heads at lot more than the Ksyrium's.

I'm 160lbs, so that's not really an issue.

Can anyone provide me any other insight, or thoughts on this issue?

Thanks
re: Zipp 404's vs. Mavic Ksyrium SL'sCARBON110
May 1, 2003 7:40 AM
Get the Zipps....so much nicer a ride then Kys. Kys are stiff and not aero at all. Bladed spokes transfer energy better but give a harsher ride. The Zipps have bladed spokes but carbon to complitment them. Also Zipp wheels are H2O proof. So you can ridem in da rain. Get them in clincher, Zipp fixed any issues they had last year
c'mon! I cant believe this!the bull
May 1, 2003 8:44 AM
Your recomending that this guy train on Zipps!I got a guy on my Team and He had some Zipps at the begining of the season.He has had nothing but hub problems(rear)!And these are Race only wheels!I got a pair of kysriums and so do my friends!There are no problems so far except a frt rim on a 2003 got out of true when hitting a pot hole.They are a good wheel for both training and racing on!Also if you live in Colorado Zipps are a bad choice because they are terrible rims for going downhill!!!
c'mon! I cant believe this!ColoradoRoadie
May 1, 2003 12:03 PM
Why are the Zipps poor for downhill performance?

I wouldn't train on them, but I do need them to be reliable enough to get through a season of racing.
aluminum+glue+carbon+heat=problems!the bull
May 1, 2003 1:55 PM
Read the reviews on this very site!
I almost bought a set then after I heard my friend was getting a set a waited so I could check his out!
They are areo but they fail!No buy!As for everyone out there sayin the new ones are good let time go by and see!I'm not gonna be a guinea pig!
By the way your right!the bull
May 1, 2003 5:20 PM
you can train on the kysriums and race them.

REMEMBER

WEIGHT
AERO
STRENGTH

PICK TWO!
re: Zipp 404's vs. Mavic Ksyrium SL'sdavtnyc
May 1, 2003 8:15 AM
ksyriums are too good to train on.

get a $200 wheel set for training and zipp tubulars for racing only. zipp clinchers have an aluminum clincher strip on the outer rim that adds weight, remember you're paying for lightweight carbon rims.
well...thats one way ....CARBON110
May 1, 2003 11:25 AM
I trained on Zipps last season however I like to train on heavy wheels now or Open Pros w/ Dura Ace. I went through 2 pairs of zipps after about 6K then I bought some new wheels. But, Zipp as I know, has worked those issues out this year. Customer service I found to be tip top. $900 + wheels you want to use occasionaly. Kys are nice wheels, but Zipps are nicer in my opinion. I think Kys are sweet don't get me wrong. Aren't they the most popular wheels at races? Tubulars are great wheels for racing and 303 tubies are sweet. The 303 clincher is nice as well and no glue :) Cant go wrong either way, but I like aero wheels more...check out Nimbles Fly wheel now available in clincher. The aluminum strip of a clincher has been minimized so its not as heavy as it used to be. but 150-200 grams is a big deal for rotating weight
re: Zipp 404's vs. Mavic Ksyrium SL'srussw19
May 1, 2003 11:20 AM
I know you are probably aware that there are other wheels out there too, and everyone on this board has a favorite, but I would tell you to look at the new Cane Creek Volos Team Ti wheels. I have owned both the wheels you mentioned above, but you don't want to use a Zipp as a training wheel. Keep it a race day only wheel. Also, much of the allure and advantages of the Zipp disappear if you use the clincher.... they rock in a tubular, but the clincher is the same as the Cane Creek at 1550 grams for the pair. The Kysriums are actually lighter in a clincher... 1530 grams.

But the advantage of the Cane Creeks... the wieght of the wheels is concentrated at the hub. The spoke nipples are actually inside the hub flange, making the wheels lighter at the rims. Less rotational inertia, means faster acceleration. And they are the smoothest wheels around with the Ti spokes. They use high tension titanium spokes for super strength, yet amazingly subtle ride. Find a shop or a friend that has them and give them a test ride.. they are worth it. Also if you look around right now, you can find last year's Aerohead Team Ti for around $500. The difference between those and the new Volos is the Volos have a larger hub shell diameter to make the wheels a little stiffer, and they have an offset rear rim for dishing reasons. And you can get the Volos in a Campy 10 freehub. The Aeroheads were only available in Shimano freehubs.

But if you are set on the two wheels you list above and are set on clinchers, you would be a fool to buy the Zipps over the Mavics. The Mavics aren't as aero, but will be lighter than the clincher Zipps and much stronger and stiffer. And the Mavics are cheaper to boot.

Russ
Russ a few corrections........CARBON110
May 1, 2003 11:37 AM
Cane Creek does make the best wheels as far as I am concerned. They are my main sponser and boy am I glad :) Can't go wrong withem. As for zipp and mavic, zipp will replace you wheel in about 2-3 weeks. Mavic, you will have to buy a new wheelset or wait a long time if your lucky. Zipps are not fragile, especially tubies. Cane creek carbon rims are made by Zipp. As for weight, aero wheels will ALways be better then light spoked wheels. Steve Hed has proven that agiain and again. Cane Creek carbon tubies wheels weigh 1445grams.
Russ a few corrections........russw19
May 1, 2003 9:28 PM
The guy in the original post talks clinchers so I stuck to them. In that case the K's are actually the lightest. I personally have bought and riden a bunch of the stuff out there and I get stuff for free too every year... that said, I bought the Cane Creeks last year Aerohead Team Ti's and I bought them again this year Volos Team Ti's. They are the best that I have riden which is why I bought another pair of them. I am riding these when I could be riding the Bontrager Race X Lites for free instead. But I chose to spend money for the Cane Creeks because they are that good.

Carbon, I know what you are saying about Hed and aero wheels... my only point was that when comparing the weight of the Ksyriums to the Cane Creeks, the weight is at the hub of the CC's while more concentrated to the rim of the Mavics. I also never went so far as to say the Zipps were weak, but I am of the opinion (and I admit it to be pure conjecture, not an analytical observation) that the Ksyriums are a bit stronger. Zipp and Cane Creek are both American companies.. and both have amazing customer service... Mavic's customer service is a bit suspect, and you may have to send your wheels overseas to get them fixed.

I never addressed the Cane Creek Aros Superlight, which is a wheel I would love to ride, but I feel I am a bit heavy for. That's the wheel of theirs that is a carbon rim. The Ti spoked version is just over 1300 grams... it's sweet and designed to compete with the Campy Hyperion. But that wheel is also a lot more expensive than the Volos, and only a tubular. I think the wheels you are talking about is the Aros Deep Dish. It's just under that 1445 mark now with the Ti spokes and still under 1500 for stainless spokes. That all said, I still think for an average do it all wheel, go for the Cane Creek Volos. If you have the bucks, get the Ti spokes... the ride is that much better and worth the extra cash... if you are on more of a budget, get them with stainless steel spokes. They are still the best wheel set on the market by their design. Take my word or Carbon 110's!

Russ
Cane Creek Over Mavic 7 days a week :) 'nm'CARBON110
May 2, 2003 5:17 AM
weight...divve
May 2, 2003 7:59 AM
....I know for a fact that I can begin to feel a difference of around 300g per wheel set. According to the page below however, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference in the end result.

http://www.bike.com/template.asp?date=8%2F1%2F2001&lsectionnumber=6