RoadBikeReview.com's Forum Archives - General


Archive Home >> General(1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 )


continue adding weights?(13 posts)

continue adding weights?Peter E
Nov 11, 2002 3:16 AM
I have done some weight lifting for about a month now. I find that i can manage more weights pretty often and so far i have added as sonn as i can manage it.
Now i've been starting thinking about, should i continue this, becuase i know that this development will sooner or later fade of and i want be able to add strength this rapidly, and try to get as strong as this off-season can get me. Or should i stop adding and start doing more reps to add my strength at that level instead of building more and more muscels?
add more weightColnagoFE
Nov 11, 2002 6:32 AM
If you want to build strength add more weight for the same # of reps. I'd shoot for 8-10 reps personally.
5% every 4 weeks, for a training program check out...Spunout
Nov 11, 2002 7:19 AM
Friel's Cyclist's Training Bible. It will help you design a strength training program so that you can enter your cycling season at maximum strength, without being burned out.
The extremely basic basics of weight trainingretro
Nov 11, 2002 8:30 AM
There are all kinds of theories and permutations of how to get the biggest gain fastest, but basically you add weight to build bulk and strength, add reps to tone and build endurance. One very basic plan is to start an exercise with the amount of weight you can handle for three sets of eight repititions. As you get stronger, go to 10 reps, then 12. When you can do 12 with good form, add enough weight to make 8 a challenge and start the cycle over.
Do that for six weeks or so, then if you're working for tone and endurance, add reps. If you're more concerned about big pecs or whatever, keep adding weight at low reps.
There's been a ton of stuff written about this, and you can find it easily online or at the library.
You need to understand the concepts behind weight liftingPODIUMBOUNDdotCA
Nov 11, 2002 9:47 AM
Good job doing weights. This is a start and will really help you next season. However, to make the most out of your training time I'll help you understand a few concepts about weight lifting.

1) Size doesn't mean strength - sure bodybuilders are strong compared to your average joe but most of the time when they go to the worlds strongest man competitions they get whooped. Why? They have all that size but when it comes to pure strength they are only using a fraction of it. Another example are Olympic lifters especially the smaller weight classes and how much they lift for their size. This is the concept of muscle recruitment. They use ALL their muscle. Thats why a lot of power lifters (lift max weight in bench, deadlift and squat) do an incredibly high number of sets ini certain phases but this can also be done doing 12 reps.
2) Specific adapatation to imposed demands - also known as the SAID principal this basically means if you do weights for reps eventually you will plateau and possibly if you overtrain go down. My friend went into the weight room and would just lift 285 lbs for reps a couple times a week on bench. He was doing 8 reps then dropped down to 6. Why? Because his body had adapted then he stopped giving enough rest. This is the common plateau most body builders talk about but now with periodized programs changing the reps and exercises done every few weeks this has been minimized. Of course your body has a plateau but this is much different than a plateau where your body just adapts. This concept basically means that you have to keep adding more weight when you can and the first couple months is where you see the biggest gains.
3) Hypertrophy (breaking down of muscle) and recruitment (getting all the muscle fibers to work) are 2 different things however they can be achieved doing higher reps and often happen with each other. The standard guideline is 12 but you can go up to about 30. After that you are starting to put more and more pressure on the tendons which can lead to injury.
4) Periodization is the concept of breaking down your training into a long term plan. So say from now to the spring... then cutting that into smaller segments like months and even smaller cycles like every week encompassing all the things you'll be doing. If you read up on this its easy to do on your own or you can get in contact with me below. Another option is find a good personal trainer who can help you establish this. From there they can teach you the excercises and perhaps get a tweak every month to make sure your doing everything properly.
5) Here is a basic guideline for the reps that go against some of what I said but they are fairly basic:
Power: 1-3 reps - faster tempo (1 down-1 up)
Strength: 6-8 reps - as fast as possible (1-1)... if your fall shy of 6 reps thats okay
Hypertrophy/recruitment: 9-12 reps - slow it down (at least 2-hold-1)
Endurance (lactic capacity): 15-30 reps - good tempo 1 second down (eccentric) - 1 second up (concentric) - just be away endurance weights are more lactic capacity than actual endurance

Theres so much to explain and I don't have time to explain anymore but basically keep switching the reps up every couple weeks (periodization). Find a good book or articles on the internet and use those as a baseline and go from there. Or if you would like either my help email me at nick@podiumbound.ca or go to the website of the people I work out with at www.sportdevelopment.com .

Have fun, train hard and you'll see the results in the spring!

Nick
PodiumBound.ca
hypertrophybrider
Nov 11, 2002 11:26 AM
Actually, Nick, the term you were looking for relative to muscle breakdown is "catabolism."

"Hypertrophy" is actually the adaptation of the muscle by growing new fibers (rare) or increasing the volume of the muscle cells. Of course, there's two types of hypertrophy, but that's beyond the interest of this board.
re: hypertrophyPODIUMBOUNDdotCA
Nov 11, 2002 11:47 AM
Thats interesting... the term I've always been told whether by the strength coaches I utilize or in seminars I've taken is hypertrophy. Perhaps its a common misconception/oversimplification of something happening physically.

Out of curiousity how are new fibers grown since the basic premise of weight training is your only making muscle cells bigger? And isn't the increase in muscle size a result of catabolism which causes the cells to grow (increase in volume)?

Nick
catabolismColnagoFE
Nov 11, 2002 1:23 PM
basically the muscles using themselves for fuel if no other source is readily available--at least how I have understood it. this is why it's a good idea to eat some protein after cycling for recovery...to minimize muscle catabolism.

Main Entry: ca·tab·o·lism
Pronunciation: k&-'ta-b&-"li-z&m
Function: noun
Etymology: Greek katabolE throwing down, from kataballein to throw down, from kata- + ballein to throw -- more at DEVIL
Date: 1876
: destructive metabolism involving the release of energy and resulting in the breakdown of complex materials within the organism -- compare ANABOLISM
re: hypertrophyJon Billheimer
Nov 11, 2002 1:24 PM
Catabolism refers to the breakdown of a cell or group of cells due to imposed stress. During the recovery period the cells adapt by creating larger contractile proteins so that cross-sectional mass is increased. This is called hypertrophy. Hypertrophy simply means "larger". The process of creating more muscle fibres is called hyperplasia. There is actual doubt if more muscle fibres are ever created at all in response to exercise stress.
re: hypertrophybrider
Nov 11, 2002 1:36 PM
Very true. For some reason the hyperplasia term escaped me earlier. However, there is experimental research to indicate that creation of new muscle fibers does happen (division of muscle fibers), and that it can be induced to a certain degree (see the latest spate of myostatin inhibitors -- satellite cells can be induced to produce new muscle fibers).
Off-topic just a bitTrekFurthur
Nov 11, 2002 10:46 AM
Don't forget that lifting all those weights without neuromuscular adaptation to the bike will ham-string your efforts a bit. That's not to say you won't see any benefit, but if you get on the bike and spin after a lifting session, and augment the lifting session with on-the-bike power workouts, you'll be much stronger as you're teaching your body to put its new-found strength into the range of motion particular to biking.
Not truePODIUMBOUNDdotCA
Nov 11, 2002 10:51 AM
Your absolutely right you do have to teach the body to use the strength on the bike. But you don't have to worry about doing it until later in the offseason. Through the winter if you build a good base on the bike aerobically and build strength in the weight room in the range of motion on the bike (make sure to do upper body/core stuff too though) as you get close to the season you can start to spend more time on the bike doing strength workouts there.

Nick
PodiumBound.ca
re: continue adding weights?Peter E
Nov 12, 2002 3:20 AM
A big thanks for all the input.

As it is now i do 10 reps in 3 sets and add weights as soon as it starts to feel well to lift the weight im doing.

I'm doing this 3 times/week and from what i learned now it may be a good idea to continue this but go for less weight and between 15-20 reps every other week.

For the bike-adaption topic i can say that i do spinning after im done with the weight-lifting.

So far i've been doing weight-lifting for 5½ weeks and i'm planning to do this untill mid February, then it's cycling only. The season starts in late april