|Is Trek OCLV Crit compatible???||Swat Dawg|
Nov 9, 2002 8:16 PM
|I have been looking at Trek Carbon frames and am wondering how they are for racing crits. Is the handling sharp enough for it, or is it more geared toward stuff like the tour? I am a little worried about carbon if I drop the bike in a corner. I am a prretty young guy (21), 165 lbs in college, and what I've read from so any of you, is that is soaks up vibration, but does this mean is compromises on acceleration? Also, if you have any other ideas about ideal crit bikes, I would appreciate suggestions. A bike that is really stiff is not a concern. I'm new to road riding, but a strong MTB, and have been doing well in group road rides.
Thanks for the help
|re: Is Trek OCLV Crit compatible???||teoteoteo|
Nov 10, 2002 12:32 AM
|Just to be in the open I sell Treks. My answer is to search for another bike if you worry about damaging a frame in a crit. The material and acceleration is fine but the durability is less stellar. Carbon tubes are strong and can resist some loads while others KO them. Crits--especially higher catagory ones are high crash affairs and thus I suspect you ask the question based on that knowledge.
You will hear a lot of mixed info like Trek can repair the frames and replace the the damaged tubes--which is true, BUT not done so much. I just feel like the frame replacement cost is too high and though Trek's warranty department is good, it doesn't treat race crashes as warranty. Not that any company really does but other materials offer you higher durability and better offerings in a crit machine. Even a Trek 2300 is a solid option.
Trek is strong in the fact that in some cases you can get a crash replacement frame--sort of like "you fu**ed up bike, but we'll still help out" kinda deal. Essentially you get a new frame for a major discount (about shops cost) and you are still a happy camper. Although it's a Trek program it doesn't guarantee EVERY Trek dealer is going to be jumping up and down happy to serve it up to you. If you bike a Trek feel out the dealer to see what the say and ask more than one person so it's not a token promise made at the time of the sale.
Carbon frames are awesome but I push them less to active racers on budgets. Just my opinion.
|I understand your point but I totally disagree....||CARBON110|
Nov 10, 2002 5:35 AM
|In my experience I have had great success. The dealer is an enormous factor in any bike purchase. I know my dealers insode out and make sure I get A++ service, treatment, and a discount. I race my butt off all year. I have owned 8 OCLV bikes, 3 mtn and the rest road. I have only broken one, a mtn bike and Trek, due to my Excellent dealer, replaced in less than three weeks without me even paying for shipping, a phone call, or anything. I had my fisrt crash this year in road racing. It was bad, me and 9 other people. My 5900 went up down over and under, skipping alog the pavement at 27 mph. I immediatley got up ran over to my bike and the only thing wrong was my pedals were scratched up. I was amazed and impressed. So since the USA is crit dominant, alot of people I know have wrecked their OCLV's in one way or another and all of them, some even twice, have ahd their bikes replaced by Trek. My dealer told me it cost Trek $30 to make the frame, yeah, so its more important, if you have a good dealer, that theykeep a good name then worry about losing so much money on replacement. Also, Trek changed how it builds warrenty frames now. They used to just make a bunch of extra frames but now they hve a new building just for warrnety frames so they can make them at will. This cut down the cost of warrenty frames enormously. So go get your new bike and feel confident, just buy it from a good dealer that you like and respects you! I' going out for a 31/2 hour ride on my oclv now, its 65 already in NC.... :) Yea Baby!|
|How could it cost Trek only $30 to make an OCLV?||koala|
Nov 10, 2002 8:06 AM
|Could it be $300? I mean, its carbon...|
|How could it cost Trek only $30 to make an OCLV?||CARBON110|
Nov 10, 2002 10:58 AM
|I have no idea, but thats what I was told. I know the molds were like half a million and the TT bike alone cost that much in research and development. Perhaps that own a manufactuer or have locked in to soe kind of deal. Or maybe they buy it in large amounts. I'm not sure, I do know they have a great business department who know how to keep the company profitable and produce a good product. They have been making carbon bikes since the early 80s.|
Nov 10, 2002 11:20 AM
|Think about it, $30. Lets just assume they did not have to pay for any machinery, dies or molds. And no R & D costs. And no marketing costs. Just the cost of raw material and the employees to assemble the bike would be WAY more than $30. The carbon fiber, the glue and paint. Plus skilled labor. That alone would be a couple of hundred dollars per bike.
|How could it cost Trek only $30 to make an OCLV?||Kami|
Nov 10, 2002 11:21 AM
|I think that's what the material costs. There really isn't much that makes up a frame. Once you're done all the R&D, and you have the mold, an individual frame doesn't cost all that much to make. But that's only if you consider that the first frame cost the company several millions of dollars.|
|It actually costs around $15 dollars to make an OCLV frame||climber1|
Nov 11, 2002 1:56 PM
|I used to be a trek inside sales rep,
The cost of materials is around $5
and it costs $10 in labor to actually build the frame.
it does not take a skilled worker to actually build the frame. they just put the raw carbon in the mold and then pour in the epoxy, the research and development costs are minimal now, the trek OCLV design has not really changed since they first introduced this design. they just use lighter higher quality carbon, and epoxy. The margin that Trek makes on OCLV is HUGE!! and not quite worth it anymore. Trek has lots of problems with the carbon seperating at the seams, if you look at a nude OCLV carbon frame you can see the seams, at the head tube, bottom bracket and at the top of the seat tube and chain stays, and under some stress these pieces seperate. the Monocoque design is much better it is one piece and will not seperate. The Giant TCR carbon Frames put the Trek OCLV to shame to tell you guys the truth. Plus they are cheaper.
i would check those out.
|Sorry, don't believe you.||Ian|
Nov 11, 2002 6:58 PM
|Lets say you pay a worker $10 per hour. His cost to the company after benefits, taxes, etc. comes out to about $20. So you are saying there is only 1/2 hour labor in building a frame? And all the carbon, epoxy and paint only costs $5? The last time I bought a can of Krylon, it alone was $5. As I said before, impossible.
Nov 12, 2002 10:45 AM
I've worked in manufacturing, people always forget about batch size. If the frame assembly consists of three workstations, 20 minutes at each one, but a batch size of 5 frames, you have 12 minutes touch time in each frame. If an assembler is getting $10/h pay, the variable cost is more like $40/h, then you have the fixed costs to amortize. I have no idea how the line is set up at Trek for these frames. I do know, however, that they are tube-based frames, and could be assembled pretty quickly. CF tubes don't cost that much because they come out of a machine at a frightening rate. I wouldn't belive the numbers I see posted here, but they don't quite defy logic either.
|The best material for a crit bike, on a budget is...||hayaku|
Nov 11, 2002 2:01 AM
|Steel. It's cheaper but easy to make a stiff frame. Strong as anything out there. And everybody knows it's comfortable. (I rode a carbon bike for the first time yesterday and it was nasty! really harsh, that was a big surprise)
As far as I'm concerned, the only type of race that steel isn't the best is for long hill climbs. And for the price of a Trek you could get a sweet, sweet steel bike. If you're on a real budget, I say look into steel.
Good luck, and if you do get the Trek... Take care.
|re: Is Trek OCLV Crit compatible???||McAndrus|
Nov 11, 2002 4:55 AM
|I don't own a Trek but have ridden 5200s and 5500s and know guys who own them. The one guy I knew who raced his cracked the fork in a race crash and then switched to a Lightspeed Sirius for racing.
In my absolutely personal opinion, I'd say a racer on a budget would do well to consider a Giant TCR or Cannondale. Both can be inexpensive - particularly if you buy used (like eBay). Both also perform very well in race conditions.
Last year I bought a Giant TCR frame just for crit racing. If I break the frame it won't break my bank to replace it.
Oh, and I'm sure the Trek would perform very, very well in a race. Trek makes excellent frames. It's just the cost and inconvenience of replacing it if you break it that bothers me.
|Vicious crit racing||No_sprint|
Nov 11, 2002 10:54 AM
|Here in SoCal, the overwhelming crit ride is Cannondale. This is partly because most of the teams I can think of have it as the team bike. You'll find lots of OCLV out there too. I prefer alu because it's superlight, super stiff and relatively inexpensive. I currently race a Ciocc and a Quantum Pro. The QPro is incredible. I strongly recommend it. I don't remember seeing any steel this season. I'm sure there were a handful though.|| |