|Another SUV driver...||JohnSmith|
Sep 20, 2002 12:16 PM
Sep 20, 2002 12:37 PM
|What the hell does this have to do with a SUV? Do child beaters only drive SUV's? If you drive a SUV you must beat your child? I guess if she would have been driving a Civic it would have been OK. Because everyone knows if you drive a civic "you care" for the enviroment & for the children.
SUV drivers are greedy and evil. If she drove a Civic this just would not have happened.
Last time I checked this was America. A free market enterprise. I can drive anything I can afford and want. I only have to justify it with myself. I could get by with a $1000.00 bike but I ride a 4,000.00 bike. I could watch a 27" TV but I watch a 60". I could go on & on but I'll stop now. I think you all get my point.
Lew & his Suburban.
|naw, I think it's because she's white||DougSloan|
Sep 20, 2002 12:48 PM
|She's a child beater because she's white. Or, could it be the sandy blond hair? The brown eyes? Republican? Union member? There must be some association we can make.
Sep 20, 2002 1:06 PM
|It's actually because she's white trash.|
Sep 20, 2002 12:54 PM
|SUV's cause this country to be more dependent on foreign resources. Be a patriotic American and don't buy an SUV.|
Sep 20, 2002 1:09 PM
|Really unrelated to the topic of this thread, but I can't resist. Let's be fair:
[SUV's][vans][pick ups][cars][motorcycles][mail order items that are trucked][airplane flights] cause this country to be more dependent on foreign resources. Be a patriotic American and don't buy an [SUV's][vans][pick ups][cars][motorcycles][mail order items that are trucked][airplane flights].
|Be a patriotic American and read this.||JohnSmith|
Sep 20, 2002 2:55 PM
|Which of the following causes our country to be MORE dependent on foreign resources?
|Be a patriotic American and read this.||Skip|
Sep 20, 2002 3:15 PM
|I would bet that the US military is number 1 in useage of petroleum products - probably way above all SUV use.|
|Be a patriotic American and read this.||JohnSmith|
Sep 20, 2002 3:37 PM
|and if it wasn't for our citizens buying gas guzzlers, we wouldn't need such a big military to protect our oil.|
|Be a good Earthling and read this.||Chainstay|
Sep 20, 2002 3:59 PM
|I'm observing that the argument is about what motives are intrinsically American or un-American. Rather a narrow vision for the planet is it not? Especially considering the weight of global responsibility on your shoulders.
Maybe it would be best if we all rode bicycles manufactured by socially responsible employers in third world countries.
|Be a patriotic American and read this.||fbg111|
Sep 21, 2002 4:49 AM
|I think the military is just like auto-racing. They use a lot more petroleum per vehicle, but there are soooo many more SUV's and civilian vehicles (several hundred million) than there are military vehicles (several hundred thousand).|
Sep 20, 2002 3:02 PM
|"mail order items that are trucked"
How is this any different that trucking product to a store?
Worse if you consider the buyer is also going to drive to that store in an SUV and then drive home.
Sep 20, 2002 1:12 PM
|Right... buy an import instead....|
Sep 20, 2002 1:13 PM
|My guess is the poster drives a Honda, rides an imported bike or two, has a ton a foreign imported clothes and kitchen appliances, etc.|
|This guy's analogy is silly, but your SUV is a waste||Lazywriter|
Sep 20, 2002 2:38 PM
|of resources. You could hide behind all that "American way, free enterprise" bullsh#% but unless someone really needs to utilize that much space for work or 7 children, they should be limited.
There is no way you can justify it to any intelligent person be is a "soap box" environmentalist or just someone like me who is not wasteful by nature. I saw some stupid
cu$t today in a Seqaua (sp?) and she was backing into a spot and had 2 inches on each side. She wasn't a carpenter hauling lumber and tools or a small business owner delivering a catering job. She was a ridiculous suburban housewife in a rush to buy chinos at the GAP.
Buying a $4000 bike and a 60" t.v. (oh and by the way you must be proud you are such a success)diesn't have negative ramifications for the rest of us, but wasting resources and further keeping us even more dependent on foreign oil and polluting the envoronment does affect us all.
I have a Civic as well as a VW GTI that I can fit a ton of stuff in the hatch and do it rather quickly with the turbo engine and still get 27 mpg. I could be driving a lot of other cars, but gas mileage is imprtant to me and it should be to you with your bloated, wasteful tank.
In the 70s they took the "gas guzzlers" off the roads but today's SUV are even worse on gas and that is a fact. We have gone backwards and most people who think they are looking stylish in their luxury SUVs, are a burden to everyone. Actually, if you wanted to be patriotic, you should be driving a car with better gas mileage. Your thinking is simply illogical and if you drive a suburban as a daily driver to feel big and secure, your schweenie must be quite little but you car needs to be huge.
|My comment was for LEW and his Suburban||Lazywriter|
Sep 20, 2002 2:39 PM
|any decent point you might have made is lost||DougSloan|
Sep 20, 2002 2:53 PM
|Any legitimate point you might have made is totally lost among your personal, crude, immature attacks. What do you expect to acheive doing that, other than alienating people and more firmly entrenching people in their views? Plus, allies you might garner will not want to be associated with you and your non-sense.
Substantively, though, what makes you think you can size up and render judgment upon anyone's vehicle choice based up 30 seconds of observation in a parking lot? Do you know everything else that is occuring in their lives? They might well have a legitimate use for their vehicle, depite their freedom not to be required to justify to you or anyone else. Don't you think you are being a bit prematurely judgmental and intolerant?
|Oh Doug, the moral cop and self appointed||Lazywriter|
Sep 20, 2002 3:18 PM
|consceince of the board. I really can give a rat's ass whose support I can garner because I know I am on the $$$ about a lot of things. And yes I can tell you that most of the spoiled suburban housewifes in the affluent area in which I live DO NOT NEED these tanks and cannot even drive them properly. The auto body shops are making a fortune becuase these idiots cannot NAVIGATE these wasteful machines. I live and work with these idiots and tell them they are idiots for droving them when they have no reason to.
Mark my words, there will eventially be a restriction on these things any YOU KNOW IT. So instead of being proactive and say "hey, I can cut down a little now", you and all the other morons driving these guzzlers will be forced to drive smaller engines in the future. The well will run dry and you can hide behind the "american was and we are free to pollute and waste ideology" all you want but you will never convince a free thinker. Yes, I have little tolerance for stupidity.
Think about it logically, SUVs are recent(last 10 years or so) hot seller's as everyday vehicles. They went from true utility vehicles that were bare bones to these luxury car type vehicles. The same people who got along fine with sedans and wagons and small cars now want to buy what is hot not because of need, but because the want to be stylish.
Sep 20, 2002 4:03 PM
|you are absolutely right in saying that there will a restriction on the behemoth SUV in the future. it's called simple economics! fords needs to sell 45,000 excursions per year for it to break even (on that vehicle). they estimate that only 35,000 will sell in 2002. there will not be a 2004. it will continue next year, and then that's it!
people who drive SUVs are not all bad people who cannot drive or are hell bent to waste resources. i drive one and don't think the back seat has been flipped up (so someone can actually sit in it!) 10 times in the 3 years i've had it. it's used to haul shit, plain and simple! granted, the vast majority of the big SUVs are driven by housewives. i get buzzed and honked at by women in mercedes and lexuses (lexi?) at least as much as somone in a suburban. all i can say to those who are proponents of the little hybrid cars and the micro econboxes is, get hit in one! i'm not saying by a SUV, but by any thing! it'll fold up, with you in it. i got hit by some drunk a'hole who ran a stop sign when i was in high school. you know why i lived? the big f'ing chevy blazer i was driving!
don't make such broad generalizations about things.
|Uhhh...on big giant TVs and monitors||kenyee|
Sep 20, 2002 4:07 PM
|I guess you missed the show on Dateline a while back about how American companies are dumping TVs and monitors on poor asian countries by promising them they can "take out the electronics and resell them", when, in reality, the mercury and metals in the CRTs are leeching into the soil and causing a much higher rate of cancer, mutations, etc.
That's MUCHHHHH better than just polluting our own environment. :-P
Also a factoid for you: in Malaysia, there is an annual tax on your car that is dependent on the displacement size of your engine. Cars are really foul smelling there and gas is really expensive. Air quality is horrible too. Don't think there is a magic solution where you can just address one thing and the world is suddenly a better place...
|Oh Lazy, you silly f*ck...||Ahimsa|
Sep 20, 2002 5:59 PM
|...for once I agree with you.
"We have gone backwards and most people who think they are looking stylish in their luxury SUVs, are a burden to everyone."
Something must be done about it and I'm sick to death of hearing loud, blustery, red faced "Amera-cuns" telling me how it is some God given right to be a wasteful, short sighted tool.
As Americans, we are priveleged compared to most and should use that status to set an example. Stop being so damned concerned with your rights and start owning up to your responsibilities. THAT is what America used to be about. Or at least what it SHOULD be about.
|Preach it Muthafu(ka!!!!!!||Lazywriter|
Sep 20, 2002 6:32 PM
|Not greedy and evil, just selfish and inconsiderate.||czardonic|
Sep 20, 2002 3:33 PM
|Owning an SUV is an advertisement of your contempt for your fellow Americans.
They are not concerned about the geo-political ramifications of these gas-guzzling machines.
They do not care about the environmental and public health problems exacerbated at an unjustifiably increased rate by these oversized and inefficient machines. All cars cause pollution. That does not justify choosing a car that causes more pollution than available alternatives.
They do not care about the increased burden on tax-payers to maintain roads degraded at a higher rate by their over-sized cars.
They increase their safety at the expense of everyone elses. Most modern cars have crumple zones to absorb impact. SUVs have rigid frames designed to crush everything else. Thus, SUV drivers enlist the cars of other unfortunate citizens as their crumple zones.
Ameican car makers who popularized these vehicles for strictly economic reasons have a long history of exploiting their hard working American employees.
These products are technologically regressive. Their popularity hinders reasearch and adoption of technologies that could re-vitalize the American auto industry, and instead allows it to fall even further behind foreign manufactureres who have been beating it at its own game for decades.
So, I am afraid that I don't get your point. By all means, go on and explain what is so "American" about owning one of there station wagons for poseurs.
Sep 20, 2002 3:50 PM
|Not greedy and evil, just selfish and inconsiderate.||merckx56|
Sep 20, 2002 4:16 PM
|exploiting american auto workers? i know a guy who works at ford in michigan and he makes, are you sitting down?, $27 dollars an hour! he's got two kids in private school and a big ass boat that he keeps in a marina on the lake! who's zooming who here? the reason the american economy is so out of wack and cars are so expensive is the fact that the average american UAW auto worker makes around $20 bucks an hour! before overtime! $50 large to install tires on rims all day? i know it's monotonous, but Jesus, a freaking monkey could be trained to do it! and don't say that american companies move to mexico because they can pay less. we all know that is true already. the kicker is, ford pays it mexican workers upwards of 250% of the normal daily skilled labor wage in mexico! $12 bucks an hour south of the border is getting PAID!
autoworkers have historically been very well compensated and have always had a strong union.
don't infer that they are being used by the big, bad corporate machine in this case. if that machine never existed, you be typing in german or japanese right now!
if you want to bitch about being american, you can go be something else!
by the way, this is a focking cycling board! shut up with this bullshit!
|SHUT UP? You say, you are writing more than anyone else.||Lazywriter|
Sep 20, 2002 4:19 PM
|"if you want to bitch about being american....||Ahimsa|
Sep 20, 2002 6:19 PM
|...you can go be something else!"
Yeah! That's right! You pinko commie longhaired tree hugger! This here is Uh-mer-ick-uh where might makes right and waste is only a problem for those lazy saps that chose not to work hard enough to own an eight cylinder Dee-troit engine! Shape up or ship out! We don't have room in our democracy for people with different opinions than ours!
"don't infer that they are being used by the big, bad corporate machine in this case. if that machine never existed, you be typing in german or japanese right now!"
Brah! Please tell me this is a farce! Please tell me you were intending tongue in cheek! That is the single most ridiculous comment I have heard in years!
Are you refering to that largely agricultural and isolationist "big bad corporate machine" of pre WWII America? I assure you that it was a very different animal when compared to the multinational mega-conglomerate modern "big bad corporate machine" of today.
Either way it had little to do with our not speaking Duetschland's mother tongue.
(This message has been brought to you by Ahimsa, a division of Draketech Enterprises. Draketech, we don't make the things you buy, we just make them in foreign countries for peanuts a day.)
|The big bad corporate machine||czardonic|
Sep 20, 2002 7:06 PM
|I find it very ironic that you voice such contempt for working class Americans, and such blind support for corporations, and then impugn my patriotism. If auto workers have anything they have it because of their unions, which were created in spite of corporations and their efforts to prevent workers from organizing. Your standard of living, inferior as it may be to those over-paid and shiftless auto workers, is thanks to the brave efforts of unions workers on your behalf. Corporations have fought tooth and nail to keep wages and worker's rights down. Why don't you walk into any bar or restaurant in Flint and tell those people what a bunch of spoiled brats they are?
Are you completely impervious to irony? Japanese and German cars are far superior to America's, and workers in those countries are generally better compensated.
|Back off on the unions.||husker|
Sep 21, 2002 3:42 AM
|They are responsible for bringing more Americans into the middleclass than anything else, and ending abusive practices by employers. That means a better standard of living, college education and a better country for everybody. If you want to bitch about people making more money than they are worth, look at the CEO of major corporation and then complain about the costs of products. And to nip the argument about poor quality and poor skills of workers in the bud, who hires factory workers? Not the union. Who engineers the products produced? Not the union. Who is reaping most of the profits for shipping jobs overseas or accros the border? Not the union. I'll stop now before I start singing "Look for the union label..."|
|suv's aren't relatively socially responsible....so what's the ne||curtybirdychopper|
Sep 20, 2002 4:15 PM
|ws in that? i agree that suv's aren't as socially responsible as a typical car. but why get so excited about it. its not news. its really ignorant to disagree with this fact. justify it...fine. but why get so excited about it. i guess many have strong convictions about it, but don't i wouldnt be so quick to bash others who don't agree, unless you can claim that you are completely responsible in all other areas of your life.|
|Maybe if America could pull its head out of its ass...||empacher6seat|
Sep 20, 2002 6:35 PM
|for ONE SECOND and take a look at things with a bit more of a global perspective those beastly luxury SUVs would never have left the drawing board. You guys are all debating about "what's best for America". America already has it pretty damn good. You guys are riding around on bikes that cost more then millions of people in the world will ever make in their life. there are countries around the world that America is screwing up the @ss by exploiting their labour, taking their resources and really offering minimal assistance to them. Maybe America would have to spend less on their military if they actually gave a damn about other countries and helped more counties in need.
On an unrelated note, the revolution against the SUV has already began. It's called the SmartCar and it's made by Mercedes.
Sep 23, 2002 3:28 AM
|She is beating her kid because she was upset about not getting cash for a return item. She can't or won't pay 200 dollar parking ticket. She has been in trouble over retail fraud. Yet, she drives a car that has a payment (and consumes more $$ per month) than most peoples house payment.|| |