|Mercier or Motobecane Reviews||niteschaos|
Apr 28, 2002 5:35 PM
|I am shopping for a bike to get started into racing and I've found all sorts of deals and what-not and all sorts of reviews on bikes and the companies that sell them. I've had trouble finding reviews on two lines, Motobecane and Mercier. Mercier makes 853 Reynolds Steel road bikes and Motobecane makes Kinesis Aluminum bikes. I want to hear from the current owners of these bikes (particularly the Motobecane Champion and the Mercier Serpins) on how they ride, quality, overall enjoyment and such. Thanks for your time.|
|Beware of SPAM||Alpedhuez55|
Apr 28, 2002 7:23 PM
|BikesDirect.com is a big time spammer of this board. Both of those bikes are sold by them. Many of the reviews are probably by an employee or employees of that company who are trying to drum up business. They did it last year when they introduced Primal Fear bikes. Lately Mercier is being pushed by them rather annoyingly. I would not be suprised if you get some of these fake reviews saying it is cheaper than a Lemond, Trek or Cannondale. That seems the only selling point of any substance that is brought up. They may even try to trash me like they did when I tried to point out there obvious SPAMMING on earlier threads.
Motobecane and Mercier are old French brands that faded away. Motobecane was a great brand in the 70's and early 80's. Someone bought either distribution or name rights and has frames built in Taiwan. Some very nice bikes are being made in Taiwan. I have bought three Surly frames myself. Kinesis is a good factory. You may even find the same frame as the Mercier with different paint decals used on other bikes at your LBS.
I bought an $1100 Ultegra bike two years ago and ened up selling the generic fitting frame and buying a LeMond Zurich Frame which fits me perfectly. Not all Reynolds 853 frames are built the same. The shaped tubing and geometry make a world of difference.
Fit is the most important part of any bike. Find one that fits you right first. The aluminum frame will be lighter and most likely stiffer. The steel will offer a smoother ride. Just be very aware that it is very likely that any response you get is likely from a salesman and not an owner.
Let the Buyer beware!!!
|Trying to aviod spam||niteschaos|
Apr 28, 2002 8:56 PM
|See, I'm trying to aviod spam. I want real opinions about what these machines are. As a college student I dont have alot of cash to throw around, so I wanna get the best deal out there in my price range, which right now is around 1100 bucks. If I dont get anything real outta this I'm gonna just save up a few more months and get something from the local bike shop, but it won't be Ultegra equiped (Like a TCR-2).|
|so anyone to disagree with you is a SPAMer from BikesDirect?||cyclopathic|
Apr 29, 2002 6:34 AM
|paranoia strikes deep|
|finding info and getting objective opinions||century2|
Apr 29, 2002 5:05 AM
|I have a Mercier Serpens I got at an LBS ~ paid a little more than the online price; but I love the bike. There are a couple of guys on the board that have Motobecanes and post once in a while. Plus there are a bunch of SoarGrapes posters who have never seen a Motobecane and flame them anyway [I think because they overpaid for their bikes] Anyway, you can find nice quality Full Ultegra bikes for around $1200 brand new with warranty; it just takes a little searching. My opinion is Steel is best if you ride long distances ~ and the Mercier Serpens is nicer than the Lemond or Bianchi Ultegra bikes.|
|Real or spam||vitusdude|
Apr 29, 2002 5:22 AM
|Is this a real review or a spam review?|
|I guess since I road my bike over 200 miles this weekend||century2|
Apr 29, 2002 6:31 AM
|my review I guess is real. But i can no longer tell the difference - here's how I see it
1) if you like a bike and advise others to get one it's SPAM
2) if you like to buy from GVH it is not SPAM
3) if Corodao cyclist has a nice looking girl in their catalog - it is not spam to promote it
4) if you do not like lightspeed - you are an idiot
5) if you think $3000 is too much to spend on a bike; you are a cheap bastrad
6) if you read bicycling magazine and mention their site; it is Spam ~ especially if you mention the bike finder
7)if you want a new bike with warranty instead of peicing together something from old or used parts - you are a fool
AND you are SPAMing whatever bike you want
8) if you really want to own a Colnago C40 - you have great taste
9) if you like Specialized its ok I guess; not not if you like a Fuji made in the same factory
10) if you can not spell - you can not ride - go back to sckool
|finding info and getting objective opinions||niteschaos|
Apr 29, 2002 7:02 AM
|Saying something is "nicer" in the bike world is really a subjective thing when you are staying in one price bracket. You may say that it is nicer than Lemond or Bianchi, but when you buy a Bianchi you are getting something with a warranty and guaranteed development time behind. I am having trouble finding info on Mercier and Motobecanes, even from their own websites. I'd be interested more if I could just get some REAL info about them, not sales pitches. I'm an engineering student, give me stats and figures, not fluffy words about how they make your heart sing.|
|finding info and getting objective opinions||Alpedhuez55|
Apr 29, 2002 8:32 AM
|It is hard to get a subjective opinion sometimes. If you look at the review pages most of the reviews are very positive. We all love our bikes.
THe Mercier site does not have a lot of information on the bikes such as the shaping and model of Reynolds 853 they are using. Maybe instead of saying that it is "nicer" Century2 can share a little more information on the constuction and geometry of the frame to back up his claim. For all we know, nicer could mean prettier. THey may ride great. I do not know though since I have not seen them. There are just a few posters who only come out to plug these bikes but never mention anything other than the price as a real selling point.
I would try to find other bikes like those by Iron Horse KHS, Uivega or Raleigh at a local bike shop and see how you like the ride. I think some of them are from the same factories. It may give you a better idea of how Mercier or Motobecane may ride. Fuji makes some pretty good aluminum frames at a slightly higher price point than the Mercier or Motobecane.
|speaking of Mercier||cyclopathic|
Apr 29, 2002 9:54 AM
|Lance won his first race (at age 13) on his brand new Mercier.
Maybe you should ask him about how it rides 8-P
|speaking of Mercier||Alpedhuez55|
Apr 29, 2002 7:40 PM
|There is no logic in that statement. You cannot trace the current Mercier incarnation back to the one Lance once raced when he was a teen. It will be like trying to trace a Schwinn that you may buy at K-Mart when Pacific mass markets them to the old Chicago Schwinns. They are two different companies all together.|
|re: Schwinn, Mercier etc||cyclopathic|
Apr 30, 2002 4:17 AM
|the Mercier Lance raced was an equivalent of K-mart Schwinn: seamed lugged steel. SO my example isn't "Mercier is a fine bike" it is more "it is not about the bike" if you misread it.
With respect to "old" Mercier Mercier in its glory times made some high end frames, sponsored tour rides, etc. Very few of those frames made over the pond, so even "old" Merciers are being collected for "sentimental value" not for "quality".
with respect to "new" Mercier it is nothing as portal for asian mfg frames the same way as so much prized you pre-Pacific Schwinn was. Nothing to do with the "real" US made Schwinn, it is not the first time Schwinn went bankrupt. I only smile when I hear people preaching "the sky is falling.. old Schwinn is gone". Yeah right, for a few decades now.
|I doubt that you will||grandemamou|
Apr 29, 2002 10:29 AM
|As best I can tell the names(motobecane,mercier) were purchased by a marketing company. They don't actually produce anything. They buy from an overseas Mnfr and put the names on the bikes. A domain name search showed both moto and mercier registered at the same address in FL.
The bikes might be fine. The whole thing sounds a little fishy to me. I am one of those guys who paid too much for his bike (name brand). And I am happy with my decision.
|yes, and it is residential||cyclopathic|
Apr 29, 2002 12:19 PM
|this is how it looks from satellite
the Serpens build kit looks very suspicious, I swear I so exectly the same bike under different brand name. It is probably the same frame as Jamis, Dean etc were selling..
Anyways it is probably "standard" 853 tubeset (not pro no tube shaping so on) and it rides pretty much like one.. some may complain about BB flex. Curious what have they used for rear? probably 525 just like LeMond..
|....speaking of geometry||cyclopathic|
Apr 29, 2002 1:56 PM
|these two are suspiciously alike:
|Major BS alert||grandemamou|
Apr 29, 2002 4:20 PM
|A quick author search reveals that century2 owns not only a Mercier but also a Motobecane. What are the odds? I know hundreds of cyclists. Most own multiple bikes and neither model is represented. Other than a retro model I have never seen any at races or large organized centuries.
Most of the posts deal with either these two bikes or ranting about the fact that nothing is "really" American made. Seems to know alot about who manufactures what and not much else.
A few minutes on the internet yields a wealth of info.
|Well done! Thanks! nm||Uncle Tim|
Apr 29, 2002 5:57 PM
|he probably does work for BikesDirect||cyclopathic|
Apr 30, 2002 4:42 AM
|unless he is that guy from Florida ;)
a few facts before you make the same allegations aganst me:
1) I don't live in Florida
2) I own neither of the bikes
3) I am not affiliated with BikesDirect
4) I have no plans to buy either.
there're people on this board who know me personally, they will correct if I stated something wrong.
However I stand my ground:
- Quite a few brand names if not just relabel products, at least OEM it to asia.
- either frames is probably fine, I suspect that Motobecane is relabeled Kinesis and Mercier's geometry and sizing is suspiciously like Fuji
Since I haven't heard anything bad about high end TIG weld steel frames from Taiwan, and the components on Serpent are recognizable I would probably consider it for commuter/rain/train bike. I suspect I might complain later about soft BB, but I have similar complains about LeMond and Bianchi.
o'k this horse is beat to death let's move on
|I never meant||grandemamou|
Apr 30, 2002 6:27 AM
|to insinuate that you worked for these guys. Although I don't know you, I do know that you have posted quality posts on this and lots of other topics.
I also did not mean to say that there was anything wrong with these bikes or other Taiwanese bikes for that matter. It just gets my goat when someone misrepresents themselves or their products.
If the guy works for the company and feels it's a great product why not just come out in the open and say so. Just makes me wonder if there is a reason he would not. There is also nothing wrong with keeping traditional names alive. Triumph motorcycles was reborn. It's a new company but they are still made in England and there is a concious effort to maintain continuity with past Triumphs.
|Motobecane le Champion is relabled Kenesis||cyclopathic|
Apr 29, 2002 9:47 AM
|I think. Kinesis OEMs for many, almost as much as Giant.
As far as I know Kinesis is pretty conservative (as opposite to innovative ;) Noone particularly prizes it /or boos as the matter of fact/.
btw if I were you I'd be cautious to buy frame without testride, esp if you're looking at size under 53. On smaller bikes geometry tends to be all over the place
|Nothing wrong with Kinesis||Nessism|
Apr 30, 2002 5:44 AM
|It is true that Kinesis makes frames that are sold under several different brand names. They used to have a US factory located up in the North West somewhere that was making frames for Serotta among others. Kinesis, as well as most of the other Taiwan manufactuers, are very experienced builders and know what they are doing. I think the bike will be fine so long as it fits the rider.
Regarding the 853 frame in question, this is very good steel and should last the rider a long time. It is likely that they are using some other tubing for the rear triangle, such as 725 or 525, but this is not really a bad thing. If anything, it will add a little more stiffness since the tubes are likely to be slightly thicker.
At the risk of sounding like spam myself, my understanding is that Chucks Bikes "Tusnami" brand frames are made by Kinesis. For the price they are selling these at, one could buy a frame and build it up with the equipment of choice for a very low price. Just a thought.
|yeah chuck is a nice guy||cyclopathic|
Apr 30, 2002 6:37 AM
|to deal with I bought a few things from him now and then. He can sell you a frameset or build it up for you.
with respect to Tsunami frames I'd recommend looking at those with Columbus carbon rear. I've ridden one and it is amazing how well it works to eliminate road hiss. You can probably build it up with Ultegra under 1000$, similar bike would run you double.
anyways we'd better shut up before SPAM nazis track us down and tell us to buy only what Style Man approves.