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Cat 1,2 = carte blanche to be an a-hole(22 posts)

Cat 1,2 = carte blanche to be an a-holeeschelon
Apr 22, 2002 8:35 AM
I did this race this past weekend and got dropped bad in the B race...along with everyone else...bad head/cross winds...and Paris Rubaix (sp?) style conditions-3 miles of sloppy mud dirt road conditions.

Anyway, here's the scoop, I was all by myself just trying to finish the race with no paceline to help me...I noticed the A race group was closing in fast so I simply pulled over to the side of the road as far as I could go and still keep rolling along, and as soon as the A group passed me, some a-hole screams at me while passing to "get the f**k off the road!"...I mean, it's a frickin' race...I got really pissed, so I screamed at the top of my lungs f**k you! I mean, jesus; it's not like I was screwing up the paceline or stopping him from winning this race so that he could look good in front of the imaginary USPS scouts.

Anyone ever have to put up with these "I'm a god cat1,2 racer type?"
re: Cat 1,2 = carte blanche to be an a-holeMrCelloBoy
Apr 22, 2002 8:41 AM
I think you gave as good as you got. The world is full of A**holes. You just have to decide which ones to scratch.

Sounds like he gave you a good way to vent your frustration.
Lapped riders piss people off.mixinbeatz
Apr 22, 2002 9:48 AM
and for good reason. In two races so far this year, I have gotten very close to crashing into lapped riders that were tinkering along the road in the worst places. While this is not the riders fault, the promoters need to pull these people to make the field safer for all. While it may have seemed like a rude move for someone to yell at you, it may have seemed rude to him that he almost slammed into your back tire as you tinker down the road. Best policy, if you get lapped or passed by another group, either pull completely off the road or don't slow down soo much that you cause problems. Also don't take the yelling personal, that is part of the fun of bike racing.
Racing brings out the best and worse in everyone.MB1
Apr 22, 2002 8:43 AM
Look at it this way-if he was doing well he would never waste the time and energy on yelling at you.
A-holes: it's not just for Cat 1-2's anymoreTig
Apr 22, 2002 9:02 AM
I've seen my fair share of a-hole elitist Cat 1 or 2 racers, but the majority have been decent, if not nice people once they know you. Ah, there's the key... THEY must get to know and trust YOU sometimes before they start to acknowledge you! Stupid? Maybe. Think about this. By the time someone works their way up to such a level, they have learned to ride well and survive, but only after crashing far too many times, and usually thanks to some dumbass that pulled something stupid near them. They become distant and untrusting of unknown riders, or someone who doesn't look like they are safe. I'm not defending anyone for being an a-hole, but shedding a little light on why some are like this.

I still don't understand why some feel the need to belittle others who have a well rounded life instead of the 2nd job lifestyle (all riding/training and no play) of a Cat 1 racer. I'd much rather have my happy family, car payments, and a simple, comfortable house over a racing license that says I'm a really fast racer.

I know of many more riders who are pure a-holes not because of their racing level, but because that is who they are no matter what! The same can be applied to any group, such as drivers. Ah, now THAT sounds familiar!
re: Cat 1,2 = carte blanche to be an a-holemmquest
Apr 22, 2002 9:32 AM
I'll bet that we've all met our fair share but, like Tig said, it is more of who they are than what they are. For example, in your case, only one of the A racers yelled at you. It is a little bit of a jump to assume that they were all A holes. Just remember:

1) you are always at your worst when you are exhausted during a race, both you and they guy who yelled at you might have taken things differently in a different situations (besides, it sounds like your race conditions were particularly gruesome)

2) don't judge a group based on the actions of a few. I don't like it when motorists judge me based on the fact that I ride a bike and they have seen other cyclists do stupid stuff on the road.
True...but you misunderstood...eschelon
Apr 22, 2002 9:39 AM
Good point about the only one racer being the jerk...however...I was not implying all elite racers are that way...but you must agree that a lowly cat 5 racer would probably never yell at a cat1,2 racer being overtaken in a race...rather, the hostility exists because the lowly cat 5 racer was getting in the way of the more better racers...I mean like, how dare that lowly racer get our way!
Agreed...(nm)mmquest
Apr 23, 2002 9:47 AM
actually, you were in the way....rollo tommassi
Apr 22, 2002 9:52 AM
I know that does sound bad, but for a massed group to overtake a single rider, it is most dangerous for the guys in the back. Even if the speed difference is less than 5mph, the pack can't see ahead, and no one is going to tell them to keep left. On training rides, the guys in front do point out potholes, or joggers, or parked cars. But in a race, this is not always feasible. You're going along at 20pmh and suddenly, there is a tree going 18mph in front of you.....

For this reason, it is best to move to the left of the road (of course, don't cross centerline, but on a closed course this is ok) or for the best safety, pull off the road entirely. The 10 seconds or so that this takes may save you from being hit from behind. Never try to join a faster moving group by pulling into the front.

Don't feel that it's a 1 versus 4/5 thing, it really has to do with everyones' safety.
I thought that, in a race, if you lose the draft, you're off thebill
Apr 22, 2002 12:58 PM
back, you ought to just take yourself out and go work on your sprints in the parking lot or something. I guess if you're on a BIG circuit or road race, you have to get back to your car somehow, which means on the road, but I'm not sure that I get the "got to finish" mentality. You can go ride hard somewhere else, right? The track would be for racers, not for you to complete your training ride.
I don't know; what are you supposed to do? I haven't raced, myself. I want to, but I haven't felt ready for just these reasons. I'll be happy to finish in the pack to experience it, learn something, then we'll see, but if I go out there and get shellacked, with no hope even of finishing with the pack, what's the point?
usually the 2-3sColnagoFE
Apr 22, 2002 10:22 AM
I rarely have found the 1s to be rude unless you give them reason to be (ie getting in their way etc). Usually it's the 2-3s who are rude. Suppose it comes with the territory. You don't move up without having a certain agressive type personality. It's also the reason why I rarely race and why bike racing will likely never be a very big sport in the US. Who wants to pay $ to get lapped and then yelled at by some elitist a*hole?
What?mixinbeatz
Apr 22, 2002 11:29 AM
"You don't move up without having a certain agressive type personality." Yes, you have to be aggressive on the bike to win.
How this aggressiveness has any effect on the popularity of the sport is a mystery to me. It doesn't matter in what country in the world you race, you have to have some guts to do well. Cycling is an aggressive sport. My advise, don't pay $$$ and don't race if you are going to get lapped. In my opinion, if you don't have the strength to hang with the group most of the time, you shouldn't be racing. In my experience it is usually those who will never be in the final contention that cause most of the crashes.
I guess by your logic...most of us should quit racingeschelon
Apr 22, 2002 11:37 AM
over half of us should never race at all since we may get dropped or lapped...right? Maybe a better idea for cycling to grow as a sport and interest in America should be the racers who suck should simply watch you really fast guys race and worship the ground you guys ride on.

I guess you fast racers never sucked. I bet you fast racers who are the god of all racing were always fast...hell you guys probably came out of your mothers twat on a Colnago...right?

It's so easy to forget about how everyone starts out when these memories exist only in the past...and therefore become easier to dismiss as ever happened.
I guess by your logic...most of us should quit racingmixinbeatz
Apr 22, 2002 12:04 PM
Right, if you are consistantly getting dropped racing, in my opinion you should not be racing on courses that put other riders at risk passing you. Why race if you know you are never going to be in contention. You are just getting in the way.

This "starting out," stuff is bs. You are right, I never sucked, at racing that is. I sucked at riding my bike for a long time but before I went into racing I knew I had to work hard so I would not get dropped at races. I trained with a club, paid my dues, got into shape, and guess what. I didn't get dropped in the 4-5 fields.

If you really suck at racing, than you need to spend more time on the bike before you race.
you're proving my pointColnagoFE
Apr 22, 2002 12:29 PM
Basically if you can't hang then you have no biz racing? Can't you see how elitist that sounds? Why not encourage new riders instead of viewing them as potential obstacles for you to avoid. Not all of us have time to train enough to be a cat 1-2 but we still like to race when we get time. That's why they have 5 categories--to accomodate everyone. If you're so great at 4-5s then upgrade for gods sake--you have no business being there anymore. what cat are you anyway? i'm guessing 2 or a 3.
you're proving my point,mixinbeatz
Apr 22, 2002 12:58 PM
I don't think that there is anything elitist about my comments. I just think that competitive cycling is for those who want to be competitive. If you want to ride your bike fast put not competitively, go ride a century with a local club, don't race a crit where you are going to get shelled in the first lap and spend the rest of the time getting in peoples way.

I encourage new riders, but they must learn that they have a lot of work to do before they jump into Cat 5 races and expect to do well. I think that much more racers stick with it, if they understood what they are getting in to, rather than entering one race and realizing how fast everyone is and then never racing again.

By the way, I am a Cat 5 in my first year of racing, and am a couple points shy of upgrading to 3, which I will do in the next month or so.
Cat 5 guy...dumfoundedmikebikr
Apr 22, 2002 10:26 AM
Several weeks ago I was in a 4-5 race moving along pretty well with the lead group when we came upon 5-6 guys from the Cat 1 2 3 race that had been dropped and were just cruizing along. They were riding 5 abreast almost completely blocking the road. They never moved an inch as our group of about 15 was squeezed into the remaining 3 feet of road to pass them.

I guess you don't get that much brighter as you move up through the ranks.
Yep, in all categories.djg
Apr 22, 2002 1:35 PM
I raced off and on throughout my twenties. I was never much good--spent most of my time as a mediocre Cat 3. But I was on teams with some very good people. Overall, I'd say I met some excellent people in bike racing, including some very accomplished (at least at the US amateur level) racers. But my unscientific, subjective impression is that I ran into a higher percentage of out-and-out jerks in bike racing than in any other sport I've known (I also played competitive tennis through one year of a Div. 1 college program, and was involved in ski racing and soccer before that). In fact, I'd say it wasn't even close. Maybe it's the somewhat solipsistic nature of a lot of bike training. I don't honestly know. But throughout the years there seemed to be no shortage of riders--in cats above and below me--who seemed unfriendly, if not downright hostile, whether I was racing against them or not. YMMV.

Of course, there are situations where a dropped rider should just pull off the road, and more situations where a dropped rider should ride over on the left, out of the more desireable line, where others might be approaching. Being on the course--and not having been pulled by the officials--doesn't justify being a hazard. But lots of packs get strung out for various reasons, especially in road races. If you pulled over to give the approaching group plenty of room it's hard to see a problem.
solipsistic...now that's a $10 word! (nm)ColnagoFE
Apr 22, 2002 2:25 PM
there's also onanistic, which gives new meaning to being a jerk.bill
Apr 22, 2002 2:39 PM
nm
Cool, do I actually win 10 bucks?djg
Apr 22, 2002 6:43 PM
Where do I collect? I didn't know I could get money just for using 4 syllable words. Let's see, Mississippi, Argentina, Tapioca...keep them checks coming.
yes and noDuane Gran
Apr 22, 2002 7:18 PM
Disclaimer: I'm not a cat 1/2, however I'm told that I've been an a-hole at times. ;)

I've had my race rythm messed up by lapped/dropped riders. I didn't use my breath to yell at the person, but I think it is good ettiquette to pull off the road for the other racers if your race is shot.

Another poster made some claims about how one shouldn't race if they can't hang. It doesn't really matter though. With 50-90 people in a race someone is going to have a bad day. Everyone won't be able to hang on, so lapped/dropped riders are a part of racing. I've been there and will probably be there again some day. When it happens I'll pull off the course if a peleton is approaching from behind. This seems to be the courteous thing to do.

As for the attitude of the guy who yelled at you, maybe he had a bad crash in the past because of a lapped rider. Maybe he has seen bad crashes. He probably has a story that explains his venemous words. When you are spending 15-20 hours a week training you get really irked if someone is threatening your safety.