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ebay advice desperately needed(66 posts)

ebay advice desperately neededSpirito
Apr 9, 2002 6:27 AM
i listed my frameset and parts on ebay and with less than a day to go the highest bid is so low in my opinion that id rather cancel the auction listing.

im not sure and am asking for consensus as to whether its worth letting it run and hope for last minute bidders? if it reached double what is offered now i beleive its still a ridiculous amount but i would suffer my loss and let it go. im certain that i could get at double the current bid were i to hang it in my local bike store and wait a while for the right buyer.

also im in a quandry as the highest bidder thus far is with no feedback and is a newly registered ebayer. it sounds harsh but im cycnical and think its likely that the bidder is likely to disappear should he be the auction winner and also may be putting others off as i have always pulled out of a bidding war if its against a mystery bidder as it may appear to be a seller ramping their own price. should i cancel their bid and is this a bad thing to do?

i opted for a no reserve and a low starting bid as i thought it would surely attract more interest and was confident of of its value. i am genuinely thinking clearly about the value of the frame but $157.50 for an italian frame in excellent and perfect condition made of columbus tubing with a look carbon fork and new FSA crankset and new shimano b/b and h/s isnt exactly huffy value. or am i wrong?

i dont think i can list more photos, descriptions and "keywods" than i already have. what to do?

i have less than a day to decide.
re: ebay advice desperately neededscruffyduncan
Apr 9, 2002 6:30 AM
I'm sure you weren't dropping hints, but what size?
nah ...i dropped enough hints on this site already. nmSpirito
Apr 9, 2002 6:40 AM
re: ebay advice desperately neededfunknuggets
Apr 9, 2002 6:31 AM
Curious, could you just have your friend hop on and just bid your reserve price, then if he wins, you just keep the frame and pay ebay the % charged?
thats bad karma in my books...Spirito
Apr 9, 2002 6:41 AM
id rather just cancel the auction as it appears i can do that. besides ebay has been good to me and i wouldnt want to risk doing it.
The Ebay Corporation is greedyRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:20 AM
Ebay has been good to you, or the people who use Ebay has been good to you. It has been my experience that Ebay nickels and dimes you to death. Charge you to put the ad on. Charge you to add more pictures. Charge you to do this. Charge you to do that. Then they charge a commission. Then if your buyer wants to pay through Ebay, they charge you again a good percentage. I bet by the time you get done, Ebay has taken 15% from you. I realize they are in business to make money, but it is rediculous if you ask me.
re: ebay advice desperately neededTJeanloz
Apr 9, 2002 6:34 AM
I think it's your obligation to sell it for whatever it ends up at. It really isn't fair to offer a no-reserve auction that you later determine has a reserve. Just as the bidders have a good faith requirement to pay what they bid, you have a good faith requirement to sell what you offered, at the price you offered it.

How would you like it if you walked into your LBS, which had a sign on a high end bike saying "$500" and then when you put down your money they said: "I won't sell it for less than $2,000"?
not quite the same situationweiwentg
Apr 9, 2002 6:43 AM
this is ebay, after all, and spirito is within his rights to cancel the auction. spirito, if you want to cancel it, do it now. it's not nice to cancel it late, say within 12 hours of auction close. i would part it out and sell the parts on ebay. or you can advertise on rec.bicycles.marketplace. should you not have newsgroup access, get a friend to list it for you.
Can you do that?TJeanloz
Apr 9, 2002 6:52 AM
I was under the impression that a seller could not cancel an auction only because it has not met a price threshold. Wouldn't that mean that everybody would run no-reserve auctions (to pay the lower fee) and then just cancel them if they didn't like the price?

I don't know the e-bay rules that well, but I understood that there were specific constraints about how an auction could be canceled.
Apr 9, 2002 7:37 AM
you can cancel it early. and not wanting to sell the item anymore IS (according to ebay) a valid reason.
Apr 9, 2002 7:49 AM
But in this case the seller still wants to sell the item. It isn't something that you could easily be called on- but as I understand it, it is breaking the rule if you still intend to sell the item. So, you couldn't cancel the auction because you don't want to sell, and then immediately re-list it. Right?
then on a question of ethics....Spirito
Apr 9, 2002 6:57 AM
why is it possible to cancel the auctions if you are the seller.

it states that should i sell the item elsewhere then i can cancel the auction and notify all the current bidders.

the only thing im bending is that im yet to sell it elsewhere but am sure that i could get better than its current price.

i do agree with you in that the market price is the price but i really am thinking the price should be higher.

i would prefer to leave it and haven't done anything and if it trickles higher than im happy and will be passing it on in good faith and letting the buyer know all its specifics and details. i would NEVER wrong another cyclist or cheat them into bidding more as i just dont operate that way.

but i am aksing as i have never used ebay to sell before and am somewhat apprehensive. thats why im posting to ask other of their experience and what is the best thing to do. i am full of honesty and always very well intentioned and could never 'falsely" adjust the prices as im sure some sellers do.

but my question is asking if i am entitled by the governing ebay laws to cancel my auction am i wrong to do so? if anything ebay is a sellers domain and i would rather give it away to someone without the means and receive nothing for it than what it is bid for at the moment. its not entirely pride as im sure i could give to someone who would treasure it for the nice kit that it is and it would mean a lot more to them.

damned if i do, shamed if i dont.
You're playing a game of liar's pokerSlipstream
Apr 9, 2002 6:43 AM
feeling a little nervous, eh? stomach churning, nausea setting in? that's what happens to philanderers who cuckold someone who has always been faithful to them.

Seriously, you opted to play the true auction game, not the crap everyone else plays on eBay by setting high reserves.

What you don't know is if you are reaching the number of buyers you need. I would suggest canceling the current listing and relist it by providing as much background info on Cavalera as you possibly can. State where it is made, its heritage, etc. Set a reserve just above what you are willing to accept as a minimum to make people aware of its intrinsic value.

As far a having your buds help you--well, I am sure that never ever happens on eBay.

Good Luck!
Apr 9, 2002 7:09 AM
i have 12 pictures, half a library of information and measurments, keywords for colnago, deRosa, pinarello, site links, my phone number etc etc etc

its just plain that no-one is game to buy a frame that hardly anyone has heard of and ill be honest - if i cant sell it for twice the price at my local bike store (the owners knew all about it and have been to the factory) i would rather find somneone who could use it and give it to them , failing that i would happily send it to you for the cost of shipping alone as you seem the only person to appreciate what it is. no joke!

i have never ridden it with other cyclists without them really checking it out and being interested. unfortunately i dont really know anyone that needs a bike of that size ...and yes my poker game has me doing a lot of headscratching and brow furrowing?

i have emailed the newbie high bidder with no feedback and he's a young kid who doesn't know much about bikes - i am asking whether its cruel of me to bump his bidd off in case he's drawing suspicion from other more experienced bidders.

im still not sure what to do?
Too bad, it looks like a really cool frame! -nmfloatch
Apr 9, 2002 7:23 AM
Spirito, you're a rare person indeed.Slipstream
Apr 9, 2002 7:23 AM
The last honest man!

Oscar Wilde says that "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes."

You are in a true dilemna now, bud. Do you wait it out, hoping that the smart bidders will emerge from the woodwork at the last hour, or, do you cancel and become a prick? I feel for you. IMHO, I would ride it out and be prepared to swallow a bitter pill.

It remains a mystery to me why there hasn't been a greater interest in the cavalera. What am I missing that others aren't. I feel that even at $550 it's a good price.

Hey, do you believe in the Easter Bunny?
hell yeah.... i beleive in santa, the immaculate conception,Spirito
Apr 9, 2002 7:42 AM
that all things happen for a reason, that my girlfriends really digs me, that there will soon be peace in the middle east, that life is short and special, that there really is a man who switches the light off when you close the fridge, that the government is really concerned and working towards the best of your interests, that elvis is still alive, that there is no one person that deserves to not be given oppurtunity and faith no matter who they be or what they have done, that cycling is as close to god as a man and machine together can be, that the pope really is a virgin, that rock stars really do stay nights in and watch videos, that the best thing in anyones life is yet to happen, that the world will be a better place, that ebay is an worthy and fair system and ill leave the auction to run its course, and that unless people just really say what concerns them on this board then its not worht the 1's and 0's that it uses up (what happens to all the numbers from 2-9 floating around in cycberspace anyway).

above all id just like to say 2 things to you mr. slipstream whoever you are

if you were a woman id be a lesbian

and secondly

of all the people ive encountered in my fortunate lifetime thus far - your one of them..;-) (actually your a pretty cool cat in my books - i cant say more toherwise it looks like im sucking up to you as you have nice things to say about me).

where that ahimsa dryness and smarmy humor when you need it.

keep riding as its our last ride i say
The rules of the gamemr_spin
Apr 9, 2002 7:00 AM
I would feel very cheated if I were the bidder and you canceled the auction. That's not playing fair. It's interesting how you mention the feedback of the bidder and almost question their integrity when really it is you that needs an integrity check.

The thing about Ebay is that the smart bidders will always show up late. It saves time and effort and worry if you don't have to keep monitoring the auction. All my auctions have gone mostly idle until the last day and often the last hour. Then a flurry of bids came in.

Good luck
fair call ...thats all i wanted to hear... the auction stays nmSpirito
Apr 9, 2002 7:10 AM
quote from ebay:weiwentg
Apr 9, 2002 7:44 AM
"If you are ending the auction because you no longer wish to sell your item, you must cancel all bids on your auction before it ends. If you do not do so, you are obligated to sell to the high bidder."

it may not be very nice, but you are allowed to do so. you can do the same if you've made a mistake in the advert.
hey your collar boneSpirito
Apr 9, 2002 9:13 AM
i agree with others that the sooner you start slowly bringing some moevement to it or trying to the better and faster it all comes back. it does hurt a little and after your screws come out i would seek to do somthing like yoga or swimming and get regular massages in aiding the recovery and as a form of therapy.

what usually happens is that you tend to favour that side and use the muscles opposite more than before. subconsciously, after you are well you will carry bags, lift things push from the other side of your upper body. what this does is make you slightly lopsided or more dependant on the other side of your upper body. from my own experience i had suffered lower back pain and such until i consiously tried to balance out the strength on both sides of my chest and arms.

you will be amazed at how fast you actually recover and its the begining when things seem slow to heal but then quickly all comes together. having it surgically set and plated is the right option as i had to have mine rebroken as it wasnt healing properly -ouch!

as i have twice as many x-rays as any person ive ever met i feel slightly qualified to offer my experience with such matters. if its hurting dont push it, try the next day and after all is done youll have a story and a scar to show. i positively assure you that all will be fine as my doctor said its better and the body is made for these things to break than to have shoulder damage which is more complex and difficult to fully recover from. its like natures own stress releiver.

just block out that first week and read, watch tv and surf the net as its gets boring. if you live alone i would suggest staying with friends as i had serious trouble getting dressed and, tying shoelaces and all that shit by myself for the first few days. and be carefull with any bedroom stuff as its easy to get carried away and forget in which an ooohhh and ahhhhh is followed by an OUUCH!!!!
Apr 9, 2002 3:26 PM
What you are proposing is certainly not ethical and also not exactly within the rules. "no longer wish to sell" means you plan to keep it, or destroy it, or whatever else, just not sell it. It doesn't mean you still want to sell it just at a higher price. I think you are pushing the limits of the interpretation here. Why ebay has such loose language I don't know. Maybe to screw the bidders since sellers pay them the fees.

But anyone with any sense of logic knows that to allow seller to cancel at will totally defeats the whole point of no reserve auction.

I hope I am not being harsh, but there are many things in life that are borderline, and you can choose to do it or not, and people have different reactions.
EBAY is a money producing machineRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 7:00 PM
Since ebay has little overhead, it is mostly all profit. They liberally state rules, but don't enforce them. It is very easy to have someone raise your bidding price. They could track ip addresses very easily to enforce this law, but they don't because the higher the bid the more money they make.
little overhead?mr_spin
Apr 10, 2002 6:19 AM
I go by the ebay complex on my way to work and trust me, they have plenty of overhead! Enough to fill several buildings. It's not just some kid with a server in his room.
The rules of the gamefunknuggets
Apr 9, 2002 9:58 AM
So sayeth the current high bidder at $167.50. Haha.
you are not considering the snipers nmonespeed
Apr 9, 2002 7:06 AM
what's your seller ID on ebay? nmnyedid
Apr 9, 2002 7:16 AM
you need strong nervestarwheel
Apr 9, 2002 7:42 AM
In most cases, much of the bidding for items on eBay take place in the last few hours if not minutes. Experienced buyers know this because if they bid early someone else will come along and just bid the price up. It takes a certain amount of nerve, however, to wait out the auction and hope that some higher bids come along.

If you are really worried about the frame not selling for an acceptable price (particularly if the counter shows few looks and/or few people have bid on it), then it is perfectly acceptable to cancel an auction. It happens all the time, and I have cancelled some myself. Just don't wait until the last minute to do it. If you go that route and decide to relist the frame, set a reserve price (or starting bid) that is the honest minimum amount you would be willing to sell for.

The other thing to keep in mind is that there just might not be much of a market for used Italian steel frames from some of the lesser known manufacturers. If it were a Colnago, Pinarello or Bianchi, you would probably have plenty of bids by now. However, I have seen some incredible Italian steel frames (eg, Tomassini, Gios, and others) sell for prices that seemed ridiculously low to me. That's the marketplace, though.
re: ebay advice desperately neededDrD
Apr 9, 2002 7:58 AM
That's the risk of the no-reserve auction - as has already been pointed out, if an item is going to get bid-up, it usually happens in the last few hours or even minutes - usually, but not always... assuming this is the Cavalera frame, this is a less well known frame, so it might not get bid up too much higher (however, there seem to be a number of interested bidders, so you might be in luck)

I have had a number of auctions which I was bidding on cancelled on me - in all cases, the price was pretty low, so it wasn't too surprising that the seller got cold feet - it's annoying when it happens, but people will get over it. If it really bothers you, it's your frame - do what you want - I would just cancel the auction (but do it right now - don't wait until tomorrow), then relist in a month or so with either a starting bid equal to your bottom line price, or a reserve price equal to your bottom line. $167.50 is pretty low... the current high bidder has a proxy bid set... they are willing to pay more than it's currently at... the question is, how much more? ;-)
nah going to leave it and when its over ...Spirito
Apr 9, 2002 8:29 AM
ill post what it went for and we can all learn something.

my biggest bug is that the high bidder is a new identity and with no feedback. i have always been wary of auctions where the high bidder is a bit of a mystery and with no track record. in my auction notes i clearly stated that any bidders with bad feedback dont even nother bidding but no feedback is not much better than bad feedback. my question is just how many brand new ebayers who are first time bidders are there left in the world.

he has my benefit of my doubt and the auction will go to its end tomorrow whether it draws higher bids or doesn't. if he is a ebay newbie then he will be the biggest ebay fan should he win the auction and fair call to him for bidding high and early.

I beleive in ebay and its swings and roundabouts as far as i look at it. ebay fate gods can decide as i have done what i can in terms of offering it fairly and truly and for what it is.

it may be good just to be rid of it as im sure it has bored many of you by bringing it to the fore on this forum. but then again i suppose for some this experience is of interest and if anything i hope that some learn without going for a big loss such as myself. i have forgotten that bikes are easy to buy but not as easy to sell.
Plenty of new biddersdjg
Apr 9, 2002 9:01 AM
I've been peeking at ebay from time to time these past few months but I've yet to buy anything. I've sold two bikes on this board, and bought a third, but nothing on ebay. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that an unknown bidder is a problem. Especially as you don't have to send him the frame until he sends you the money.
I wouldn't worry about that too muchDrD
Apr 9, 2002 5:50 PM
As the seller, you don't ship until you have the cash in hand, right? Worst case, you get a non-payer, and have to relist the item again - all you loose is time.
I wouldn't worry about that too muchRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 7:01 PM
If it goes for a cheap price, the likelyhood of you getting a non paying bidder is low. People love great deals.
re: ebay advice desperately neededmaximum15
Apr 9, 2002 8:43 AM
Just checked and you have about 13 bids so far. This tells me that someone is going to try and snipe it. I think you will do good. In fact, if I weren't going to be on an airplane when the auction ends, I would probably try to win it for my wife. Good luck to you.
Some Thoughts on why its so low.chopper
Apr 9, 2002 8:53 AM
First off, there is really nothing in the title of the auction that would hit on anyone's keyword search, maybe some people search by frame size and you would come up under 52cm but that's it. Second, why oh why are you having the auction end on a Wednesday around 9:00 am pacific noon eastern?? You've cut out the chances of people being able to bid in the last hour because they are busy at work. I end all of my auctions on a Sunday when Ebay usage is at its peak. And third, its one week before taxes are due, people who haven't files yet are less willing to buy something until they know if they owe or don't owe and a majority of Americans won't know that until this weekend.

To cancel or not to cancel??
What about midnight?McAndrus
Apr 9, 2002 9:37 AM
Anyone have an opinion on a the cause of an eBay phenomenon that drives me up the wall? A lot of auctioners - who I assume are west coasters - end their auctions very, very late at night. Often these are after midnight eastern time.

There have been many items on which I'd have bid but I won't bother when I won't even be awake to take part in the final bidding.

If my assumption is correct, that these are west coasters, is there some reason they aren't considering us east coasters?
re: ebay advice desperately neededharlett
Apr 9, 2002 9:15 AM
is there really much difference in the feelings of giving the bike to someone in need for free and putting your good faith and honor in a sales transaction? seems to me that both feelings can be rewarding--
hoping you're monetarily rewarded for your honesty and faith--

"honesty and faith make you vulnerable--
be honest and have faith anyway"
...mother teresa
re: ebay advice desperately neededRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:16 AM
give me the link. i will bid on it for the crankset
The spirited wench and her parting fury blow, to the one128
Apr 9, 2002 9:19 AM
who would place her, as he thought, upon the whims of the wolves where snipers do her bidding! By ones, by zeros the value is pressed, down again down, and his spirit quaked! From her velvetine perch she holds close her hand- still, as steel, never flinching, warm looking, cool to the touch. Now! ethics and morals and markets and love! The price of this fiction that ever he loved! And now she know!! and the bell can't un-ring! What if she stays!? What then of this thing! But wait! there, through the dim, the invisible hand of supply and demand! measuring love as if it mattered, gave it status, and lifted them both, through all this madness.....

Good luck!
Well done.well written! NMLen J
Apr 9, 2002 9:21 AM
this is becoming a strange and cathartic event ;-)Spirito
Apr 9, 2002 9:31 AM
prose, ethics and im learning a great deal about faith and positivity as well.

and im evident to the fact that there are good people out there. as i have posted have received a tonne of emails from people i dont know telling me to sit and wait and everything will even itself out.

im gonna buy the cats some nice food and get myself some sunshine.
this is becoming a strange and cathartic event ;-)RadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:34 AM
I want to bid on your auction. Give me the link!
auction linkSlipstream
Apr 9, 2002 9:38 AM
auction linkRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:40 AM
Thank you for posting the link. Time to bid. Please don't pull it.
this is becoming a strange and cathartic event ;-)RadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:40 AM
Hey your post on this board seem to be working as you have made an addional $100 bucks.
Apr 9, 2002 9:51 AM
Perfecto! Magnifico!

Bravo! Bravo!


Apr 9, 2002 9:52 AM
Was it what I said?
No it was 128's post. nmLen J
Apr 9, 2002 9:55 AM
No it was 128's post. nmRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 10:10 AM
Didn't think it was mine, but needed to check. I don't say to many words of brilliance.
No mate, 128's poetic prose above. [nm]Ahimsa
Apr 9, 2002 9:55 AM
Yikes. That's creepy Len.Ahimsa
Apr 9, 2002 9:58 AM
Check the times on those posts of ours and notice also how many letters line up.


Cheers mate!

A. (Great minds baby....great minds.)
re: ebay advice desperately neededRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:41 AM
One of your problems is that your title doesn't draw people to the product. I would have never looked at this frame with your title. You must be more descriptive and definitive.
re: ebay advice desperately neededRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:42 AM
Actually I won't be bidding since FSA is not carbon.
Way to get the guy's hopes up Ron......nmchopper
Apr 9, 2002 9:45 AM
Way to get the guy's hopes up Ron......nmRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 9:46 AM
no prob.
Searched on Colnago, De Rosa, PinarelloSlipstream
Apr 9, 2002 10:28 AM
and your listing did not come up. You may not be getting the exposure you need.

You need to retest your cross-links.
Searched on Colnago, De Rosa, PinarelloRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 10:39 AM
His title is vauge. It didn't come up on any of the keywords I used. That is the problem. It isn't that the bike isn't worthy of fetching a good price. No one knows it is there. I didn't notice a counter either. That is a good indicator if people are seeing your auction or not. Also the ad is way to wordy. No one wants to read all that stuff. I recommend taking the ad off, and reposting it. Make your titel more difinitive. Also, ebay has a policy against using keywords like Colnago if you aren't selling Colnago. They may suspend you in the future for doing so, but you can always get another e mail address and new account.
Ron, you are asking this kid to be liar... bad badelviento
Apr 9, 2002 3:17 PM
And ask him to break the rules and then get a new account? What's next? Take someone's money and disappear, only to emerge under a different account? I think people should be careful in dealing with you.
Ron, you are asking this kid to be liar... bad badRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 6:58 PM
How did I convince him to be a liar. I never told him to lie. I just told him that using the word Campagnolo to sell a Giant is againt Ebay's TOS. You can get your account suspended for doing that. I simply stated if you do get it suspended, then just creat a new one. I never told him to lie.
Ron, you are asking this kid to be liar... bad badelviento
Apr 9, 2002 7:12 PM
I am sure you know runaway drivers of a bank robbery is just as guilty as the actual robber. By advicing him to feel comfortable violating auction rules and set up new accounts, you are not doing too much better than a runaway driver. What you are trying to say is you can do whatever you can get away with, rather than doing what is right and what is wrong. For example, if you take your neighbor's newspaper, no one will do anything to you, but it's wrong nevertheless.
Pull it Spirito.Ahimsa
Apr 9, 2002 10:48 AM
I searched for "Italian bicycle frame" and your auction did not come up.

That is probably 9/10 of the problem.

Relist it or sell it elsewhere. You will not get anywhere near it's value in the current auction.

That might be great for the newbie kid who told you he doesn't know much about bikes, but he won't hold onto it after the snipers arrive in the eleventh hour.

Next time bro, put "bicycle frame" in the heading, eh?


Pull it Spirito.RadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 10:55 AM
Try again. I know you will get three times as much, at least.
My prediction; Elefantino snipes it in the last second. . .js5280
Apr 9, 2002 11:32 AM
Our favorite pink elephant is a wily Ebay'er I'll tell you. . .
Lots of last-minute lurkers are aboutKenS
Apr 9, 2002 12:03 PM
I have been looking to buy a frame or bike on ebay for several months. It is very common for there to be a flurry of bids in the last few minutes of the auction. I have seen prices double in a couple of minutes. Check out the completed auctions and you will see what I mean.
Lots of last-minute lurkers are aboutRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 12:13 PM
That is definitly a chance you will have to take if you decide whether to leave it on or not leave it on. I have been very happy and excited watching auctions go nuts the last five minutes.
Here's the actual Ebay Ad for the bike to bid onRadicalRonPruitt
Apr 9, 2002 12:37 PM

<br>eBay item <br>1818984869 <br>(Ends <br>Apr-10-02 09:07:41 PDT <br>) - <br>HOT ITALIAN! w NEW PARTS 52cm no reserve