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Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?(31 posts)

Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?binladen
Mar 10, 2002 7:58 PM
I have a new LS Ultimate 2001 model, bought new through retailer, just built up with Record stuff. Problem is BB is soft because when I sprint the chain rubs outside of the front der cage on the down stroke of right foot. I am 190lbs and not really a sprinter, so this makes me very unhappy since it's an expensive bike and supposed to be stiff considering the 3lb+ weight.
re: Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?texbaz
Mar 11, 2002 4:49 AM
binlurkin,
All I can say is. I have a 2001 LS Ultimate that has been great, just a pure joy to ride no noise at the BB,chainring,front der,at all.
I weigh 180, have 2001 ultegra groupo, the bike is just fantastic. I would definetly look at the runout of your crank assy, and front der position, even though it, is hard mounted to the seat tube it could be mis-aligned.
P.S. I can't beleive you would use Binladen as a screen name, so with that knd of thought process going on in your noggin definety check your bb crank assy installation it's probably as messed.
re: Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?TheBikeNut
Mar 11, 2002 5:05 AM
First;
Make sure the derailleur is installed correctly, it is almost certain it is not set up correctly. Look here at this link:

http://www.parktool.com/repair_help/howfix_frontderailleur.shtml

Alternatives;
Buy an aftermarket BB with a steel spindle, or go for the FSA Carbon
splined crank and BB setup,

Mandatory;
Loose that 'handle'!!!!!
re: Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?binladen
Mar 11, 2002 11:14 AM
I'd be REALLY surprised if the Record cranks/BB are the cause of the problem. As for another $400 for some FSA setup, I am going to pass.
re: Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?DrD
Mar 11, 2002 5:44 AM
Definitely take a look at what the crankset is doing - maybe you are flexing the BB spindle, or the crankset? Also - take a look at how the front der. is installed - is it aligned properly (if it's angled inwards at the front, that can be a problem), and not too close to the chain? I am 210, ride a 99 Ultimate, and have no flex/noise while I climb out of the saddle or sprint.
re: Litespeed Ultimate? Crap?mackgoo
Mar 11, 2002 5:55 AM
If your really trying to diagnos I think more info is needed. Are you on the big ring? Is this a 10sp? I have found that while on the big ring and on the 2nd or 3rd cog from the smallest the front derailuer needs to be trimmed. Can't say much about the Ultimate, sure looks like a nice bike. What I do know is I have an older Bianchi Ti Mega tube which looks to be the same bike and have never had this problem, although I only weighed 185 in my hay day and now I'm down to 155.
short chainstays problem?colker
Mar 11, 2002 6:07 AM
i'm no expert but those short cs ask for tighter adjustment of drivetrains.
Huh?pmf1
Mar 11, 2002 7:43 AM
Nice handle.

I have a 1999 model and it is a very stiff bike. I can't comment on the new model with carbon stays, but unless its broken, my guess is that your problems lie elsewhere. Probably your front derailer is not adjusted correctly and/or the BB is either loose or not installed correctly. Seeming BB "sway" can also be cause by wheels that are not laterally rigid.

The LS Ultimate is a bike designed for crit racing. I somehow doubt that a 190 lb recreational rider who is "not really a sprinter" can make the BB sway.
kind of obvious, maybe...Jekyll
Mar 11, 2002 8:00 AM
As it is a new bike your cables will stretch.. If your front derailleur cable has stretched even a bit the derailleur will not extend out far enough to prevent chain rub - a little adjustment may go a long way.
Tossing words like "Crap" out about a bike many here ride without going through an even handed evaluation of the problem is probably not the best way to find a solution.
Using the binAsshole handle will not engender a lot of help of sympathy from the board. Good luck and grow up.
maybe he really is binladen?tarwheel
Mar 11, 2002 8:06 AM
Needs that Litespeed to be in topnotch condition to flee those American troops.
maybe he really is binladen?Jekyll
Mar 11, 2002 8:19 AM
nah, binAsshole is an engineer, he probably would have figured it out... LOL
maybe he really is binladen?binladen
Mar 11, 2002 10:39 AM
No, it really is the chain rubbing noise that betrays my secrecy.

OK, back to serious business. First thanks everyone for your suggestions and ideas. I have built 10+ bikes and am reasonably familiar with bike mechanics. The real problem is when I pedal hard, the crank is not in the same verticle plane, so there is chain rub only HALF of the revolution. If I look down I can see the chainring move to the right about 2mm during each right-foot down stroke, and back left with each up stroke. And that's only when I pedal hard.

The short chain stay cannot possibly be the cause for the crank to go out of the plane. The front der cannot explain the ring moving to the right each down stroke. The only problem I can think of is that the right cup was kinda easy to install, I could crew the cup almost all the way in without a tool. THere was no play but it was easier than other bike/BB combos I have experienced. But the BB shell was never faced as Litespeed proudly recommended. And the BB is Campy Record.

Suppose it really is the BB shell that was made slightly too big, what can I do? Put some extra material in the BB shell?
"Put some extra material in the BB shell?"Ahimsa
Mar 11, 2002 10:44 AM
Sure!

Build it up with Bondo auto body filler.

Or Cheez Wiz.

They are chemically similar when dry.

A.
"Put some extra material in the BB shell?"pmf1
Mar 11, 2002 10:52 AM
Or some C-4.
Too bad it's not a magnesium frame, eh? [nm]Ahimsa
Mar 11, 2002 10:55 AM
Too bad it's not a magnesium frame, eh? [nm]pmf1
Mar 11, 2002 10:59 AM
Maybe he's got some extra room in his shoes .... of all days to use a handle like that, why today?

"adding extra material" to the BB. Why do I get the impression that is this guy has built up 10 bikes, they were all Huffys?
Too bad it's not a magnesium frame, eh? [nm]binladen
Mar 11, 2002 11:04 AM
I have built up Trek, Cannondale, Colnago... None of them had this problem. So I admit I am new to dealing with BB shells that are MADE too big.

I am sure you have some good solution, since you sound so cute and smart?
kind of obvious, maybe...binladen
Mar 11, 2002 11:10 AM
THe reason I used crap is that the frame had another workmanship problem when I first got it. Had a bike shop identify the problem and had LS repair it, which took 6 weeks, not surprisingly. Now it's 5 months since I bought the frame and I have ridden it only 65 miles. I am sure you can understand the frustration.

ALso why does everyone think it's the front der adjustment? I said many times the ring moves to the right only half of the revolution. Unless someone shows me such bad front der adjustment as to move the cage to the left once every revolution of the cranks (which magically and automatically follows my cadence), I will not buy that argument.
kind of obvious, maybe...TJeanloz
Mar 11, 2002 11:15 AM
It couldn't possibly be a loose bottom bracket. The way a bottom bracket works would not allow that to be the case. It COULD be that you're flexing the bottom bracket spindle- which is possible with a square taper.

Most likely, in my mind, is that the chainring is a little bit bent. Or, you will be in the next Olympics for the match sprint. Either one.

Seriously, on the other topic, I'd wonder if your bike shop gave you the run-around on the Litespeed repair- in the couple of bad frames I sold over the years, Litespeed next-day-aired a new frame to us- they never made us wait for a repair.
kind of obvious, maybe...binladen
Mar 11, 2002 11:31 AM
Problem is I have used Campy Record setup on another bike before, and never felt I could flex the spindle. At least it won't be as flexy as the frame istelf. Also the record parts are straight out of box, brand new, and the rub only happens when I pedal hard. So I don't think it is bent.

The first repair took place in the holiday season so it was somewhat understandable. Another problem I want to mention is that the rear dropouts are about 4-5mm too close so I have to spread them a little each time I install a rear wheel. And I am pretty sure 2001 Ultimate doesn't have 126 spacing.

I was hoping to get a new frame when I saw the problems but the shop was out of my size at that time, and being an agreeable person I am (despite the handle), I agreed to have it repaired, but never expected it to drag on forever...
kind of obvious, maybe...TJeanloz
Mar 11, 2002 11:45 AM
I'd ditch your shop and take it up with Litespeed themselves. They know that not every bike leaves perfectly, and generally bend over backwards to make it right.

The rub is on at the bottom of the stroke, I presume? Also, try to see if your chainring is bent- they often are bent even right out of the box (we had a customer return ~6 D.A. chainrings until one was straight enough for his liking.)
kind of obvious, maybe...pmf1
Mar 11, 2002 11:49 AM
Yeah, but after you attach the ring to the spindle, doesn't it straighten out? Rings seem pretty flexy on their own.

That guy's frame is messed up.
Have you thought about returnng it?pmf1
Mar 11, 2002 11:46 AM
This whole thing sounds fishy to me.

Having to spread the triangle to get a wheel in says to me that there is something wrong with your frame. That in itself is reason to take it back to where you bought it an ask for a replacement frame. Not a fix, but a new frame.

Why have you sat on it for so long? Ridden 65 miles in the last 5 months? I'd have been back to the shop the day after I got it if the rear triangle is like you say it is (I assume you built it yourself, anyone at a LBS should be shot letting a bike go out the door in this condition .... if so, put that Krinkov to good use).

Like I said, I've got Ultimate and it is no noodle. In fact, many a day I prefer it to my C-40.
kind of obvious, maybe...pmf1
Mar 11, 2002 11:17 AM
So what was the problem with the frame? You didn't buy it off e-bay from the guy selling the broken C-40 did you?

I had such troubles with noise from the DA BB installed in my 1999 model that I eventually got frustrated and put an Ultegra in instead. I attributed that to the lousy design of the DA BB. No problems since.

Thanks for noticing how smart I am. And I am indeed cute also. I don't date terrorists though. Sorry.
kind of obvious, maybe...binladen
Mar 11, 2002 11:41 AM
The frame was bought from a retailer brand new with warranty, etc. The parts are top of the line, so...

I don't date terrorists either.
"the ring moves to the right only half of the revolution."Ahimsa
Mar 11, 2002 11:19 AM
The ring is bent or the ring is spaced improperly on the crank.

This is becoming one of those LS slander threads that get posted here for God knows why. I no longer believe that this thread is for real. Sorry to have even bothered.

Good day.

A.
"the ring moves to the right only half of the revolution."binladen
Mar 11, 2002 11:35 AM
It's a brand new straight out of box Campy Record 2001 crankset. Since the Campy cranks are forged and LS frame is welded, I think the frame is more likely to be causing the problem.

This is not slander, just a fellow cyclist who spent a load of cash and still can't ride the bike.
Bent spider? (NM)dcm311
Mar 11, 2002 2:12 PM
you could alway try...gtx
Mar 11, 2002 12:42 PM
bending/tweaking the front der cage a tad--if the c-rings aren't in fact bent as the others mentioned. And perhaps play with the cable tension a little bit. My guess is that a good mechanic could get this to go away.

Yeah, I'd loose the handle...
alsogtx
Mar 11, 2002 12:44 PM
check the front der height/angle
Something isn't kosher..Jekyll
Mar 11, 2002 12:54 PM
If your dropouts are not spaced correctly and you're having other drive line problems (the rub) and you're not getting any satisfaction from your shop - CALL LITESPEED... 423-238-5530.....
From the sound of things you're not going to figure this out on your own (sorry). Just call them and ask for another local dealer or if they want the frame back for inspection.
I've never had to send my LS (MTB) back but any time I have had questions LS customer service has been great and more than willing to help.
Personally, if a frame I paid that much for had ANY problems it would be returned to be fixed or credited 30 seconds after I noticed the problem.