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Wheel can touch the shoe?(13 posts)

Wheel can touch the shoe?tyrius
Feb 25, 2002 8:26 AM
I just purchased a bike and noticed something that may cause me bigtime problems in the future. When I have my cranks parallel to the ground and go to turn the wheel can hit my shoe. Is this something that is normal or is it something that should scare me? Any help would be appreciated.
re: Wheel can touch the shoe?Troyboy
Feb 25, 2002 8:45 AM
Normal. Shouldn't really be a consideration unless you're really cranking the wheel to get out of a parking lot or other tight space while traveling very very slow. If you turn the wheel that much with any speed, you'll be over the bars in a split second.
re: Wheel can touch the shoe?tyrius
Feb 25, 2002 8:52 AM
Thanks, that's what I was thinking but didn't want to eat pavement if I could help it.
No problemTroyboy
Feb 25, 2002 8:55 AM
It is also more prevalent with smaller frames. If you're on a 64cm, the wheelbase should be larger and there should be more room there. I ride small frames and all are as you mention.
fork rake can cause the problem alsoPaul
Feb 25, 2002 9:03 AM
I have a new bike with a 4.0cm rake, and have the same problem. While my other bike has a 4.3 cm rake, and there isn't a problem. Both have the same geometry (approx.), but the rake, as stated is different. Could ask the LBS where you bough the bike to change it for you. This is a problem with the LBS for not pointing this out to you. You will become conscience of this as you get use to it, putting your feet in the right position. Also a problem when starting from a dead stop, can jamb you foot.
fork rake can cause the problem alsojswhern
Feb 25, 2002 11:12 AM
Another factor is our chronological age(how old we are). As we get older, some indivdual's arches fall, thus creating a much bigger foot than in younger years. I use to wear a 7.5-8 and now in my forties I wear a 9!! Big feet same bike. Something to look forward to.
my fallen arches have fallen archesPaul
Feb 26, 2002 3:48 AM
I know how you feel. I have to buy 47's to accommate my long, skniny, ultra-flat feet. But only have over lap on my new Look. C-Dale, I guess, is designed for long, flat feet (just kidding).
Feb 25, 2002 2:23 PM
The difference between the two rake specs is 0.3 cm or 3 mm. this is well less than 1/8". Any significant "toe overlap" isn't gong to be solved by 3 mm. It's pretty common on short wheel base bikes that have "racing geometry" - typically this is found in the mid-sizes. It's made worse if your foot is largish and your cleats are aft on the sole of the shoe. One learns to live with it and in time you don't even think about it. One might ask what you're doing cornering that hard with the pedals in that position - the outside foot should be at bottom dead center.

If you go in and ask the LBS to fix it for you don't be surprised if they laugh so hard they get tears in their eyes - it's not personal. You'll really make their day if you ask where you can buy a metric crescent wrench. ;-)
Feb 26, 2002 4:01 AM
Well I have two friends who switched from the standard fork that comes on a Merlin (56cm and a 58cm), to the Reynolds Ouzo straight fork, and they both experince overlap with the Reynolds. They didn't experience it with the Merlin forks. don't know the rakes on the Merlin forks, but the change was enough to cause the problem. In fact, the mechanic warned them this would happen with the Reynolds. I'll have to re-check the specs on the wheel base. I've learned to live with it.
Paul, You may be wrongTF
Feb 26, 2002 2:48 PM
Paul, Fork rake is not to be fiddled with. If you try to solve toe overlap problem with different fork rake, chances are you are creating more problem than you are solving. It's like chopping your feet off in order to lose weight.

Forks on the market have 40-45mm rakes, so the most difference you have is 5mm which is 1/5 of an inch. But the handling can be greatly affected.

Secondly, Merlin doesn't make forks. Also the Reynolds fork blades are straight but they don't really have smaller rakes because the bend is at the fork crown.

My advice is if you really ride in a way that often require superslow speed manouvouring, go with a touring bike or MTB. Waiting before a red light is the only time I notice the overlap on my bike.
re: Wheel can touch the shoe?guido
Feb 25, 2002 11:29 AM
I have a bike with toe-front wheel overlap, and I've been running it with a fender, in all kinds of weather, commuting and on an occassional club ride, for 18 years. It's never been a big problem, but remains a nuisance. Sooner or later, usually in a parking lot, my foot will hit the bumper and rub it against the tire. I've broken two fenders this way. A third hangs on with epoxy glue.

But the main problem with this geometry is that the front wheel is probably also too close to the rider for good fore-aft balance. My bike would have been better designed with the necessary longer wheelbase to avoid toe-front wheel overlap. The trade-off in slower steering and cornering would be worth the stability inherent in a longer front end, and also eliminate the possibility of thumping the front fender against the tire when mounting the bike, or balancing at stoplights.

I think designing overall frame geometries resulting in this overlap is a deficiency, which can be avoided by simply altering the frame geometry. What do others out there think about this issue?
I thinkMel Erickson
Feb 25, 2002 1:59 PM
if you've got it, you live with it. Yes, it is a product of frame geometry but not really a difficiency in design. The designer specs a frame to produce certain characteristics and overlap is rarely, if ever, considered. I suppose overlap has annoyed someone enough to cause them to either buy another bike with different geometry or have someone design/build one to eliminate overlap, but I've never run across it. I've had/have several bikes with overlap and it's never been a problem. I could probably count the number of times on one hand that my foot has touched the wheel. Speeds are so slow that it has been totally controllable.
If you can't work this out, you have poor coordination.Barnyard
Feb 25, 2002 6:30 PM
And beside, you don't actually turn the wheel that hard when riding. I suggest you look for other problems.