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Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!(27 posts)

Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!tmguy
Feb 22, 2002 7:21 AM
Any impressions or thoughts from anyone out there? I am turning 40 next month and I want to treat myself. I love steel and this seems to be the next evolution for me from my Nemo steel Marinoni. It seems to be fairly unique combo of steel with the carbon. I test rode one and it was very nice.

Talk me into it or talk me out of it. I just want some honest informed feedback from the good folks on this board.

Thank you!
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Elefantino
Feb 22, 2002 7:47 AM
When I turned 40, I bought my first BMW. Your mid-life-crisis solution is much cheaper.

Looks beautiful, with the silver on carbon. If it felt good to ride, I say go for it. (The Marvel is nice, too, and I'd probably opt for that instead because it's cheaper and has Ksyriums instead of Nucleons, but that's just me.)

Hope you enjoy it!

FWIW,
Mike
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Dave Marker
Feb 22, 2002 7:50 AM
Well here are my thoughts on the Opera after I testrode one, nice light steel bike, pretty good handling although the front fork flexes much too much for my liking, this was my biggest dislike ofthe bike. I don't really think the rear carbon seatstays do anything for you but provide good looks. Steel is comfortable and the carbonstays seem more for looks than anything on the Opera in my view.

My biggest issues with the Opera as an everyday bike are first it's durability. EOM 16.5 is an extremely thin walled tubeset which dent's very very easily. If you are doing any kind of serious training on such a bike you'll be guaranteed to get some dents in your frame in no time. An even bigger issue for me though with the Opera was the fact it uses an all carbon fork and steerer, but it's only a 1" size, not the new 1 1/8th which everyone seems to be switching too for stiffness and safety purposes. I think this is largely what accounts for the excessive flex up front with the fork, and to me it's a real safety issue as well as a handling issue, I just would not feel comfortable using a carbon fork with carbon steerer in only the 1" size. What really concerned me about the 1" fork is that when I spoke to a very reputable dealer of Pinarellos in PA, he confirmed my suspicions by telling me that in his opinion that fork is much too flexy for anyone who climbs out of the saddle and weighs over 150lbs and that he has actually wondered why Pinarello is resistant to swith to a 1 1/8th headtube design for that bike. I think this guy is being straight with me because he sells Operas, he has no reason to lie about product faults in my view.

My last big issue with the Opera and other stock bikes in that price range is the price itself - $1850 for frame and in my view a very average fork. For $1850 or even much less you could easily get a comparable quality custom built lightweight steel frame (even with carbon stays if you wanted them) from a number of great custom US builders and it would be custom, built to your exact measurements - guys such as Anvil, Sycip, Steelman, Strong Frames (their cheif fabricator used to work for Serotta and he designed the Hors De Categorie and some of their best carbon forks). I too was very interested in the Opera at first because it is such a beautiful bike, but when you consider the 1" fork issue, the very delicate Dedacciai EOM 16.5 tubeset and the lack of custom sizing, I just do not think you are getting much bang for your buck with that bike. Every custom builder I have talked too has told me they would be more than willing to build me a frame out of EOM 16.5, but they have also said that this is a true racing only tubeset, it's not something they would recommend for everyday training and riding at all. Hope this helped a bit. If you want some of the info I have gotten on other high quality lightweight steel tubesets/framesets which is what I'm currently looking for also, let me know.
Happy 40th! Mine is next weekPaulCL
Feb 22, 2002 8:54 AM
And I'm getting a new car to replace my Jeep. As soon as I sell the Jeep, I'm buying an Audi A6 Quattro.

I got the hot bike (colnago) a few years ago. Go for it!
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!MP
Feb 22, 2002 9:29 AM
I considered an Opera, but, like others, was concerned about the steel being too thin. For the price, I'd go with a Litespeed (which I did for my 50th birthday present).
re: Pinarello Opera; I didn't need a birthday to get one!RayBan
Feb 22, 2002 10:12 AM
I bought one in early January. I've owned a lot of bikes made of other types of steel (MXL, Thron, SLX,Reynolds 525, Aluminum, Carbon(by that Ernesto guy), etc and I REALLY like this bike. I was looking for a "keeper" steel bike and after A LOT of consideration I bought the Opera. This thing was really made well. It fits me great, it is VERY light, and I desperately searched for and found one in the FASSA Bartolo paint scheme which I love. Please don't be concerned with the comments of the steel being too thin,thats not an issue unless your into putting bikes in VICE clamps for fun. This bike was built by a company that DEFINETLY knows how to build a great steel bike. The carbon fork and stays add a nice amount of comfort to the ride. I'm about 5'9" and weigh between 155-165. so for my size this thing was a perfect choice! Another cool thing is, I am starting to see more and more people post messages about the Opera lately too....
re: Pinarello Opera; I didn't need a birthday to get one!Velolover
Feb 22, 2002 10:58 AM
I ride a 55cm Pegoretti Googoolee steel bike and my frame uses the same basic tubeset as the Opera, Ded. 16.5, although the diameter size and shapes of the tubes are different. I have been riding my bike now for about 7 months and I already have a very small dent in my downtube and another small dent near the base of my seatube from road debris, I actually heard the stuff ping off my frame when I hit it on each occasion.

Steel has more tensile strength and yield value than aluminum but that's tensile strength which really has nothing at all to do with impact strength from objects colliding with the tubes. The 16.5 tubes are drawn exceptionally thin, I believe as thin as .38mm in some cases especially in the non-weld areas of the tubes and my experience with my current Pegoretti is that they are highly susceptible to denting because the tube walls are so thin.

I love my Pegoretti, love the way it rides, best riding steel bike I have, but I'm already questioning its durability and checking for developing cracks from the 2 dents before and after every ride. There are very high quality steel tubesets out there which are only slightly heavier than 16.5 and I'm guessing with their thicker walls they are much better than 16.5 at resisting dents. My Columbus Foco frame is 3 years old and doesn't have a single dent in it, although it does have some paint chips in it riding the same roads as my Pegoretti. Ded 14.5, like Foco is also more dent resistant from my own personal experience than 16.5 and it doesn't add that much to total frame weight. You may also want to contact Pinarello or Gita on any 16.5 rider weight limit suggestions, Columbus Ultra Foco for example is not recommended for riders over 140lbs.

My belief is that we have wrongly entered a bike building age where builders have become so obsessed with shaving every ounce of weight possible off a frame that common sense values like rideability and durability, which are very important for non sponsored riders has become essentially ignored. I think the high end steel tube makers have wrongly tried to obsessively make steel as light as aluminum and in turn they are now creating tubesets which may work great for a sponsored rider as a disposable steel frame, but for real life cyclists who can't afford to replace a frame with a new one each season I believe these frames have little practical long term purpose. Sorry for babbling on and on but what I have seen happen to my 3.5K Pegoretti has me really questioning the value of super lightweight steel frames for non sponsored riders. For my next steel bike I'm going back to Foco, 14.5 or perhaps 853.
Where have you been?Nessism
Feb 22, 2002 1:53 PM
Their was a long thread about a month ago regarding the virtues of Dedacciai 16.5 tubing. I voiced my concerns with the durability only to get hammered by those that aren't concern with denting and general ruggedness.

To me, 16.5 is a tradeoff tubeset. Thin and light, but flexable and fragile. I know that extra oversize tubes can be used to stiffen up a frame, but there is no work around for the thinness.

Becareful with Foco also, some of the new tubes are ultra thin.
Where have you been?Velolover
Feb 22, 2002 6:57 PM
Well, I really didn't want to be the bearer of bad news as the guy sounds like he really wants an Opera, I was just relaying my personal experiences with the 16.5 tubesets.

I agree with you, the tubeset is certainly a tradeoff with durability and flex issues and I think anyone considering buying a bike with 16.5 should really ask themselves what they want out of the frame especially from a durability aspect. I'm competely convinced that the 16.5 tubes are very flexy in a regular diameter because they are so thin. My Googoolee uses incredibly large tube diameters to stiffen up the frame, that's why they are so large, because without those huge diameters the ultra thin tubes would be much too flexy. I really think 16.5 has a place in the world of racers, but for everyday riding I don't recommend it and my own experiences with it tell me that it dents very easily. To me bikes like the Opera, the Ciocc 16.5, the Googoolee and other 16.5 frames are better left to racers and guys who are sponsored but that's just my opinion.
Better than arm warmers, which is what I got for my 50th :-) nmBrian C.
Feb 22, 2002 10:48 AM
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!ngl
Feb 22, 2002 11:29 AM
Although I won't comment on the brand of bike you should buy my recommendation is BUY IT! I bought my dream bike last year. It's nice to treat yourself once you get life in good financial order. My wife was all for it ( your too I hope) and so far its been a joy.
Italian DreamsCT1 Guy
Feb 22, 2002 12:03 PM
Bought my Italian Dream last year - OK, it's made by the other guys - but believe me it's worth it. I'm only 37, so really looking to my 40th - reckon a DeRosa King should just about fit the bill. Ignore the nonsense on other makes - there are only 3 dream bike makes out there worth having - Pinarello, Colnago & DeRosa - nuff said.
Italian DreamsKeith Cook
Feb 22, 2002 1:27 PM
There are only 3 dream bikes out there worth having, ignore the nonsense on other makes? I hope for your sake your joking otherwise you need to address your own nonsense.
Italian DreamsBrad S
Feb 22, 2002 4:47 PM
You probably think Ksrymiums are the only wheels worth having also!!!

About about something less common w/ style?

Like a Pegoretti, Moser, Carrera, Casati, Ciocc, Mondinico, Masi, Tommasini, etc.

Pinarello, Colnago, and DeRosa just spend the most on marketing, not necessarily make the best bikes
Italian Dreamsdjg
Feb 24, 2002 7:01 AM
As a fellow CT-1 rider I have to say that my buddy's Pegoretti is a damn good bike.

And then there's still Masi--the real ones, that is--Mondonico, Ciocc...
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Ron L.
Feb 22, 2002 9:37 PM
Ask a simple question and get all that other stuff. Well, I ride the Pinarello Opera, Prince and Moots as well others. The Opera is a good frame and rides great and can battle with the best of frames. Robert Millar reviewed the Opera in ProCycling I think May of 2000. He love the bike as well as the Prince. The Opera is a nice frame, you won't be sorry.

Seeing that I owne the shop, I get to ride them all.
Opera, Prince, Moots, Merlin and LOOK

Ron
Rose Canyon Cycles
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Concourse1
Feb 23, 2002 8:24 AM
Does Robert Millar have to be concerned with durability issues? Answer: NO!! That's why your average rider has to take reviews from a pro like Millar with a grain of salt. He's commenting only on how the bike rides according to him specifically, not how long it will last. What he likes in a ride another rider may hate, unless you are trying to say that every rider likes the way a bike rides according to Robert Millars preferences? I think we both know the answer to that question.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Concourse1
Feb 23, 2002 8:28 AM
I also have no idea what you are talking about concerning him asking a question and getting all that other stuff????? What the heck does that mean? The guy said he was interested in the Opera and wanted the opinions of others on the bike and it looks like that is exactly what others have provided, their impressions of the bike.

What are you trying to say, that if anyone comments on the bike and doesn't say it's the greatest thing since vanilla icecream that it's "other stuff"? From your post I think it's pretty clear to see what your motives are. A Pinarello bike salesman.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!tr
Feb 23, 2002 8:50 AM
Seems to me "all the other stuff" refers to other than RayBan, Velolover, and Concourse, all the others don't own one or ride an equivalent bike so everyone can take that with a "grain of salt". I value the opinions of people who ride one more than those who like to comment without experience with the bike. Talk is cheap and the real test is riding one and talking to those who own and ride one, not those who like to refer to this guy said and that. And yes, i own one and another bike equivalent as far as durability issues and i have been riding it since 97.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!tr
Feb 23, 2002 8:51 AM
I meant Ron L not concourse above.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Steve Morgan
Feb 23, 2002 9:54 AM
I rode an Opera for half a season and sold it. Hated the lateral flex up front which I'm sure was the one inch stock Aria fork. I'm 165lbs, pretty strong club rider and was able to flex it bigtime when standing and climbing. It did not inspire my confidence.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Tomcat
Feb 23, 2002 1:58 PM
The problems with excessive flex in the Opera fork did not begin until they began using the new Aria fork with the all carbon steerer tube. the older Opera's with the aluminum shaft steerer tube have not had this problem.
FunnyNessism
Feb 24, 2002 1:01 PM
You need to make up your mind.

First you go on to say that you only value the opinion of people that have actual experience with a bike. And then you make a leap of faith and draw a parallel between the durability of the Pinarello Opera (only been on the market for a year or two) and some other bike that is five years old.

You can't have it both ways.
above message for tr (nm)Nessism
Feb 24, 2002 1:03 PM
nm
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Ron L.
Feb 23, 2002 8:48 PM
Not to sure what starting post you read, but he asked about the Opera. You know, looking for info from PEOPLE THAT RIDES the frame not read about it.
As for my motivation; I retired at 41. I do this because I can and it's easy, not because I have to.

Remember that when you go to work for someone Monday.

Take a pill, you'll feel better some day.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Laughing
Feb 24, 2002 9:54 AM
Could you say that again in English? Sounds like you are the one who needs to take a pill, perhaps two or three for that matter.
re: Pinarello Opera; Happy 40th B-day to me!Arenberg uses straight gua ti
Feb 24, 2002 11:43 AM
Do yo own the bike shop or are you retired, make up your mind.

I was retired when I was 33 after 10 years of doing M&A work on Wallstreet, I never work Mondays or Tuesdays through Sundays for that matter. You'll probably be trying to pedal a frame on Monday, I'll be riding, remember that. LOL