|What's so special about the '16' cog??? also...||geof|
Feb 14, 2002 11:22 AM
|Is it possible to mix and match dura ace cassettes with Ultegra? In other word's, if I bought a Dura Ace 11-21 (I think it has the 16) could they be used with say the 23-25 or 24-27 of an Ultegra cassette? Is it even worth it? Or, just get yet another (11-21) in Ultegra to get the famed 16 toother???|
|16 is a very special number||cyclopathic|
Feb 14, 2002 11:53 AM
|think about it:
- it is a sqare of 4
- it is twice of 8
- it is 2 multiplied 4 times
- and the most important you can't date girls uder 16
putting that aside I really missed 16t when I switched from 12-23 to 12-27, 14,15,16,17 were the most usable cogs on flats and 1-2% inclines so 15 to 17 was an annoying jump.
I got used to it.
answering you question about custom cass I build a few from my base set Ultegra 12-27 and 105 (HG-70) 13-23. Given this combo you can build TT 12-21 (12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,21), standard 12-23, and hilly century 13-27 (12 dropped in favor 16t). HG70 is cheap, doesn't weight much and is made of loose cogs. Ultegra/DA clusters cannot be monkeyed as easily.
|...but 18 is still my favorite nm||secourir|
Feb 14, 2002 1:10 PM
|age or cog? nm||cyclopathic|
Feb 14, 2002 1:52 PM
Feb 14, 2002 3:34 PM
|but from my experience with age... how can i put this.... you make the best soup with an old pot.|
Feb 14, 2002 7:13 PM
|you don't buy every sports car you take for test drive don't you? ;)|
|think of it more like if||secourir|
Feb 14, 2002 9:07 PM
|properly maintained; a John Deere will last for life and then some. and nuthin' runs like a deere, as they say.
|here's what I did with 10-speed stuff||lonefrontranger|
Feb 14, 2002 10:03 PM
|I have a Mavic 12-25 10-speed cassette that I've customized. I removed the 14, which I don't use much. The 12 and 13 mean I don't get wound out on long descents. This makes 12-13-15-16-17-18-19-21-23-25. This gives me a 16 AND an 18, since that is significantly the portion of the cassette I use most (remember, I'm lacking in the Y chromosome dept). I've discovered that 18 is my personal "miracle" gear. Of course on the long headwind grinds home after 3-4 hours of riding, I still find myself hunting for that elusive 17 1/2.
Feb 14, 2002 12:01 PM
|Some people just like the ratio for their cadence, power and riding conditions. Change any one of these and they'd be in love with a different cog. |
You can mix 'n' match Ultegra and DA,since the geometry is standard. You may find that you'll end up with some funny jumps betweeen cogs when you modify the stack. What really matters is your low ratio for the type of riding you do and nice steps between gears. If you make a matrix of the gearing combos and pay attention to the _percent_ change between them you can make some good decisions. There is a book out called "Bicycle Gearing" or something like that and it details all the considerations.
To say that one cog is superior to all others is absurd and reflects some pretty boring riding. You can ususally click it up a notch and ride harder or drop it down one and spin. The thing that really matters is managing your heart rate.
|And if you really want to know||Mel Erickson|
Feb 14, 2002 12:28 PM
|go to Sheldon Brown's site http://www.sheldonbrown.com/articles.html
and click on his Gear Ratios or Gear Calculator articles. This doesn't really tell you why the 16 cog is special (I can live fine with or without it) but gives you insight into gearing. Once you've read and digested his tomes you will be perfectly able to select your gearing and forget everything you ever read.
|88 gear inches||mr_spin|
Feb 14, 2002 12:52 PM
|Because 53x16 is almost equal to 88 gear inches, which for some reason is a magic number in the track world.|
|88 is also the number of keys on a piano. (nm)||theBreeze|
Feb 14, 2002 4:14 PM
|...and you can tune a piano. (nm)||breakingwind|
Feb 15, 2002 7:13 AM
|W/o 16, there's a surprisingly big gap in gearing||PdxMark|
Feb 14, 2002 1:16 PM
|Calculate the gear ratios, or let the Sheldon Brown site do it for you, with and without a 16 tooth cog.
You will find that the difference in the ratios between 15 and 17 is surprisingly large relative to the other typical gear ratios (above & below the 15 & 17 tooth cogs). A 16 fills an otherwise big gap in gearing... and being in the center of the cluster, it's a bad (inconvenient) place for an extra big gearing step.
It's hard to see unless you actually calulate the gear ratios for each seqeunce...
Feb 14, 2002 9:59 PM
|That 16 tooth fills an important gap, as does the 18 to a smaller extent - it's not an issue of choosing a personal "favorite cog" . If the wind conditions/grade is just right, use of the 17 will result in too high of a cadence while most of us mere mortals won't be able to pull a 15 tooth. Thus, we have to go back to the 17 and go a little bit slower. For recreational riders, it is an annoying gap that easily be removed by use of a 16 tooth cog. For competitive riders, it could make the difference between 1st and 2nd place finishes.|
Feb 15, 2002 12:19 PM
|If you'd replace the 15 with a 16 you'd have an even bigger gap from the 14 to 16 than with the 15 to 17.|| |