Dec 9, 2001 11:58 AM
|I've never felt quite right re: the toptube length of my Litespeed Catalyst. 5,000 miles down the road and I've never felt the bike as an extension of me. Ultimately, I think that the bike is too big.
I'm going in for a full Serotta sizecycle fitting to confirm, but I think my problem is top tube length. This all feels stupid to me, because the LS was my third nice road bike. You'd think I'd have the size thing wired after ten years of semi-serious roadie riding... but I screwed this one up. I've swapped stems three times, but don't necessarily want to go smaller than the current 90mm I have on the thing.
Anyway, got a friend who can get me a pro deal on the Yeti ti. On pure geometry, it may be a decent solution because the top tube is shorter in relation to the seat tube (and standover) in comparison to the LS. Anyone have one? Anyone know anything about them?
And how much might my LS be worth? Would eBay be a good place to try and sell? It is a Litespeed Catalyst, full Ultegra except Shimano 600 headset, Look CF fork, Triple crank, Mavic OPs laced to Ultegra hubs. The bike's probably got 5,000 miles on it. I'm trying to see how much I can recoup against cost of a new bike (Yeti or otherwise).
|Won't help the fit problem...||C-40|
Dec 9, 2001 3:34 PM
|Depending on the size, (53 or 55?) the geometry of the Yeti is virtually identical to Litespeed. If the reach to the bars is too long with a 90mm stem, buying a Yeti won't help.
It's a good idea to get a professional fitting. A good fitter should check the fit of your current ride and analyze what problems may exist. For instance, do your knees and elbows overlap when riding in the drops? If so, the reach to the bars isn't too long by commonly applied standards. A longer stem would generally be recommended.
A professional fitting can tell you how your current setup differs from the norm, but there is no way to know if suggested changes will yield an improvement in comfort unless you try them for a few hundred miles. You don't want to buy a new frame, particularly a custom, unless you've first tried the fit adjustments.
What some people discover is that they simply don't have the strength and fitness to ride a real racing position. If this is the case, you may require the bars higher and closer to accomodate.
|Won't help the fit problem...||jtolleson|
Dec 9, 2001 3:45 PM
|Thanks. No, as I discussed, I'm headed for the Serotta sizecycle and a pro fitting, and won't be making any decision without that.
As for the backhanded remark regarding fitness, I'll humbly state that with 10 years riding, several centuries a season (including on the LS) and lots of Colorado hill climbing... I don't think that's it either. I was really looking for comments on the Yeti geometry (thanks for that) and quality.
|Won't help the fit problem...||gtx|
Dec 9, 2001 5:16 PM
|Looking at the geometry chart of the Yeti (who's building it anyway? who owns Yeti (or the Yeti name) these days?) I'd agree with C-40 that it's not going to improve your situation, for the geometry is very simular to LS. I'd go custom. Since you live in Colorado, why not contact Anvil bikes--a full custom steel frame should be quite a bit less than even a pro deal on the Yeti.
There's also Strong Racing up in Montana, and lots of other great custom builders out there--like Serotta, as you mentioned. It sounds like you have a short torso, or just happen to like the bars a bit closer than most people. Shouldn't be much of a challenge for a good builder. Good luck!
Dec 10, 2001 6:09 AM
|No offense intended. I've found that riding alone often isn't enough to maintain the fitness required to ride with the bars low and a reach long enough to keep the knees and elbows apart.
If I don't regularly perform back, abdominal and neck strengthing exercises, I eventually develop discomfort in the lower back or shoulders.
I just wanted to point out the the Yeti geometry was pretty standard. I've analyzed dozens of brands and found that most don't deviate more than 1cm on top tube length, once you adjust for differences in seat tube angle. If significant deviations from the standard range are needed, a custom will be required.
The Serrotta size cycle is helpful, but be sure that it uses the same type of saddle, seatpost and bars that you will use, or the information from it won't be accurate. Analyzing an existing bike can be just as helpful. If changes are suggested, it's wise to try to duplicate them on your bike and try them thoroughly before ordering a custom.
|JT, please confirm the size of your LS?||RhodyRider|
Dec 10, 2001 6:46 AM
|I am helping a lady friend shop for a new bike, and I would certainly encourage her to go used if the bike is a good one. Since I'm currently riding a Catalyst w/Ultegra myself, I can vouch for the quality here. Might have some interest...anyway, we're looking for something around 54 cm. What's yours?|
Dec 10, 2001 7:39 AM
|I may still have the old catalog with full specs, but I'm not sure. I can certainly measure. You'll recall that LS measures center-to-top so this bike is not as big as a 55 cm say, Cannondale or Specialized.
I'm just under 5'7" and "normally" proportioned (or so I like to think!)
Dec 10, 2001 9:01 AM
|Good luck in your endeavors. You seem to suffer the fate of many here and everywhere. You're likely on too large a bike. I'm taller than you with slightly short legs and ride quite a bit smaller bike. Generally speaking, you'll likely feel much better with a 53cm tt or so, if as you say, you're very normally proportioned.
I know 6 foot dudes on my team with average proportions riding 55/57s. We all prefer the stiffness and weight advantage of going as vertically small as possible.
I'm looking for a new crit bike for the upcoming season and so many LBS salespeople spread this oversized disease. I talked to one guy yesterday on the phone asking if he had a particular size and geometry. He said no and, of course, asked me how tall I was. (They are built to sell what they've got, there's no secret there.) I told him and he said I should be riding a 56cm. That is a shovel load.... Of course, he had a few in stock that I could come and ride.....
|What pains me...||jtolleson|
Dec 10, 2001 11:23 AM
|is that I'm a gal who should have known better. I'm not a new rider... the LS was 3 bikes up the food chain from my initial roadie purchase (1991 Specialized Allez Sport, followed by a 1995 Cannondale R900) and I didn't walk into the shop ill-informed about fit, or so I thought.
|Sorry to hear that!!!||cioccman|
Dec 10, 2001 12:25 PM
|Never buy what they've got unless you're dead sure. I've always special ordered mine and double checked upon arrival.|
Dec 10, 2001 9:18 AM
|I'm also 5'-7" with a 32-5/8" inseam. Most 55cm (c-t)frames fit me fine with a 110 stem. If your legs are shorter, you should have enough torso length for a 55cm. Perhaps it's your arm length that's the problem.
By the way, Cannondale measures c-t just like Litespeed, but their standard sizes are even numbers, while Litespeed's are odd numbers.
Dec 10, 2001 9:26 AM
|You've got an unusual amount of inseam for a 5'7" person.|
|seems that way...||C-40|
Dec 11, 2001 1:02 AM
|I've never read of anyone posting a longer inseam for a 5'-7" height (almost), but I fit on most stock 55cm (c-t) frames with a 110 stem.
It's easy to see why a lot of folks need 120-130 stems or a custom frame with a longer top tube to get enough reach.
I've check my inseam several times, by the most accurate method I know of - standing over a bike with the wheels blocked up. I put a 1-1/2 inch board under both wheels of my 55cm C-40, raising the standover to 32-3/4". I can stand over it in bare feet, with FIRM pressure in the crotch.
Hopefully no one will post "Colnagos have short top tubes". The effective length, after adjusting for the difference in seat tube angle, is the same as a 55cm Litespeed.
|I have access to Catalyst specs, thanks. Will advise... (nm)||RhodyRider|
Dec 10, 2001 9:33 AM
Dec 10, 2001 2:12 PM
|A good deal on something that doesn't fit right isn't much of a deal. |
Ultimately you seem to be trying to dial in your fit and have gone through some expensive bikes. Until you know exactly what you need and want (in terms of dimensions) you're just picking another card from the deck. Sure you can increase the odds by some carefull selection and hoping for the best. OR you can get the bike made for your body and riding style. If you're toying with the Serotta Size Cyle concept then maybe you should go all the way and take the plunge. An extremely high percentage of people in your position are glad they did, but it's self selection and not scientific justification.
It seems that a decent solution has not been satisfactory for you in the past so why should it work in the future? Yeti isn't known for their road bikes, not that there's anything wrong with them, but their MTB's are what people crave. Workmanship is one thing - fit is another. What ever you do, try and ride examples of the bike you're interested in, you might be surprised to learn how much difference there can be between two bikes that look virtually identical on paper.
No reason why you can't get at least $2,000 for your LS, but money is tighter now, so who knows.
No doubt about it, Serotta and Seven people (as well as others) can get the bike to fit you like a glove. I think it's important to realize that you may prefer a certain material, all the high end metal in the world obtained at a dscoount is no good if it doesn't fit right.
Good luck on your search and don't settle.
Dec 10, 2001 2:40 PM
|Actually, the funny thing is I didn't go through the earlier two bikes for fit reasons... the Specialized was ultimately stolen and the Canny totalled in my big bad crash. That Cannondale, other than being the old bone jarring variety, fit for century long comfort.
So, I'm not sure that I'm a hard fit, but I am sure that I bought too big an LS (ya know, bargain price on the leftover Catalyst frame) and two seasons of riding, three stems swaps, etc. hasn't helped me get comfy.
Dec 10, 2001 3:23 PM
|Had the similar experince with an OCLV 5200 that was just a steal at the shop. Went through a bunch of stems, bars, and saddles - and then developed some lower back pain. Surely, I thought, it was just a matter of getting the right components. I could get through a century, but I'd pay for it later. I finally sold the thing for around $1,000 when I fortunately walked into a Serotta that fit so much better. Until I rode that bike I didn't think that there could be much difference. Hell, a bike is just a bunch of tubes bonded together somehow. I used to get off the OCLV at the end of a long ride and not want too look at it for a while and cringe a little bit when it was time to ride again - now I relish all the moments on my bike (both good and bad) and am litterally left with a total stoke. All I want to do is get back on the bike once my body has recovered some and ride some more. The bike has literally elevated me to a new level - both physically and mentaly. There isn't an aspect of my riding that hasn't improved. At least that's what I tell myself! It's really not the bike, but rather how I percieve it and my level of comfort for everything from long-ass rides to hard cornering to climbing (and the Trek was lighter). I feel good so I go harder and longer. |
You got a bargain on the Catalyst so you're much better off than someone who didn't. Ultimately the LS is a "sunk cost" and whatever you paid is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is what you can get for it. You'll probably be better off if you just swap out the frame and keep your parts. That way the only hit you take is on the frame, not depreciation in turning over your parts, there's also less money laid out that you're trying to recoup and you can afford to wait for a decent offer on the LS while you ride your new rig. Keep the HS and fork installed in the old frame - it's an easier sell. Your shop may help you by letting it hang in their shop - you may be able to avoid a consignement fee if you negotiate this as you're buying your new frame. From their perspective it costs them nothing (they were going to pay the bills anyway) and it can help them sell the new frame. A shop that balks at this may indicate that they're very short sighted - maybe you really don't want to do business with them. If you do get a custom bike they might try and charge you for the conversion, but any competant wrench can do the swap over in a couple hours (transfer the bars and everything right over with out stripping the tape). Setting the HS with a press would be my advice - the shop may want to charge $35 or so for cutting the fork and all the rest. Ain't no way anyone should be taking a hammer to install a headset on a high end frame. Imagine trying to explain that one on a warranty claim.
|re: Yeti Ti?||zzz|
Dec 10, 2001 3:50 PM
|If you can get close to 2000 (taking grzy's word for it) for your Catalyst that should come close to covering a custom lugged and brazed steel frame with Ultegra or 700 to 1200 shy of a custom Ti with Ultegra. Since you got a deal on the seatpost there should be lots left on that credit limit that got you in the shopping mood before. With a custom you know it will fit perfectly and give you that added appeal of having something built just for your style of riding. Besides it would be a great Holiday gift for yourself! I'm thinking an carbon Easton seatpost would look great on an Axiom or Legend...|
Dec 10, 2001 4:13 PM
|How much was that credit limit¿ Seems those prices don't include a few things....wheels/fork/handlebars...Anyway, what the hell, it's only money........................|
Dec 10, 2001 4:21 PM
|Every last one of yaz!~