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OK, I've thought about it(13 posts)

OK, I've thought about itDog
Sep 13, 2001 2:13 PM
Some of you are right about something. I think I unfairly linked some things people (harlet, Delia...) said to some generalized beliefs about certain kinds for people and certain issues.

I apologize for getting personal, over generalizing, and a bit over zealous. This whole thing is getting to me, on several levels, including fundamental, core beliefs. I shouldn't take it out on anyone here. My preference is not to vent at all. Something just set me off here. You all are my friends, and sometimes it's easier to vent on friends than strangers.

Others are right in two respects. First, we are all on the same side. Second, we are all cyclists, and come here to share that passion.

Aside from this, I'm not going to participate in any more of the political threads, though. I'm practically begging Gregg to remove them.

Doug
re: OK, I've thought about itMe Dot Org
Sep 13, 2001 2:46 PM
Yesterday I heard some political pundit quoting Rudyard Kipling that the first Law of the Jungle is to keep your temper.

It's VERY difficult and quite understandable that people respond with passion and anger in this situation. We ARE all on the same side. Whether liberal or conservative, in a democracy we give our informed consent to the rule of law. If we do not like the law, or the society for that matter, we work in non-violent channels for change.

It is the radicals of both the left and the right for whom the ends justify the means. That (to me) is the beginning of terrorism, of what you described the other day Doug, as denying the humanity of your opponent. Although liberals, moderates and conservatives may differ as to the exact nature of the causes of and solutions to terrorism, we are united in our opposition to it as a means of political expression.

In the past few days I've read some things here that have been quite moving, and other things thant frankly, have been disappointing. But we will move on, in the cantakerous, sometimes juvenile, sometimes eloquent ways that our discussions ramble.

I for one, am very glad this forum is here, and thank you Doug, for contributing.
Takes a big man.........Len J
Sep 13, 2001 2:57 PM
to look honestly at himself. I suspected you would, and I appreciate that you did.

So how's the Foot?
Is the 508 out?
Do you hate shimano?
Are you really a c-40 guy?
Do you really use a camelback?
Are you ever a fred?
C'mon, help me out, what else can we talk about?

Damn we do have some good people on this board.

Len
yup, I'm a Fred, tooDog
Sep 13, 2001 3:12 PM
The foot is better. I have orthotics, and it seems to be healing. I'm shooting for the 508, foot be damned. Too much invested at this point. Doing long weekend rides and interval workouts mid-week.

Hate Shamano? No. My Bianchi EV2 is Shimano equipped (lighter), and my Milano has some Shimano parts. Right now, Campy (because of the derailleur mess) is not at the top of my list. We'll see about warranty, if UPS starts working again (delays due to you know what).

I love the C40. In all honesty, if feels like the perfect bike for me. Don't know what I'd change. I've said it before, it's like driving a new Porsche 911 - solid but still razor sharp. In comparison, the EV2 feels like a Lotus Europa or Elan.

I use a Camelbak for long, hot rides, not in the mountains. Riding 200 miles this Saturday (Fresno to Las Banos, then up Pacheco Pass, and back), and will likely use it. Don't like it for climbs, though.

Me, a Fred? How about getting the runs during an event, hopping into a porto-potty for 20 minutes, and then after riding again, brushing my face with my glove, only to discover you-know-what on my glove, and on my face, too (lesson, remove gloves for #2). I could go on with Fred stories for a while, but I might soil my image too quickly.

Dog
Glad the 508 is still on......Len J
Sep 13, 2001 3:18 PM
keep us posted. I for one, am living vicariously through you on this one.

Len

P.S. LOL on the face wiping.

P.S.S. In Alaska, after peeing at 3:00am, wandered back to my tent & ended up getting into the wrong tent (there were 800 of them after all). Imagine my surprise to find a young women in my sleeping bag. Imagine her surprise to find me in her tent. Freds Unite!!!!!
question for dogpeloton
Sep 13, 2001 7:46 PM
Doug, How are the orthotics working for you? Did you get them as a result of the injury, or were they part of your program before? If you got them after the injury, how did their maker alter your alignment? Curiousity from a sport science perspective. Any input to your experience with orthotics would be appreciated.

PS- Don't feel bad about your posts. I and many others here have definitely argued over much more trivial things. At least it took a major crime against humanity to rattle your cage enough. (You should have read some of the posts I chose not to bring to the board- so bad they bothered me even) I've actually gotten pissed in Campy vs. Shimano debates. Being human sucks sometimes.
Respond to bike posts......Len J
Sep 13, 2001 3:03 PM
and let's move the political stuff to the bottom by making most recent posts all be about bikes.

One way to fight back.

Len
Your humanity is showingmk_42
Sep 13, 2001 3:06 PM
I tried really hard not to post any political opinions but I too finally put one down below.

You lost your temper, you got personal. It happens. But I think that you said something even more important. "You all are my friends" I feel that way too. In some strange internet way we are all friends because we all ride. Most of the time we are only talking about bikes because most of the time that's all we think about. Last day or two we can't think about that because even riding has been eclipsed.
I think this board isn't about bikes (I don't see any bikes posting) but about *people* who ride bikes. People who ride bikes talk about this too. Like many posters I read this board a lot and write only seldom but I feel like I know a lot of you a little even if you don't know me. I don't like many opinions I've read here recently but that they come from the "real" posters I "see" every day, rather than the one day flame bait handles, makes them palatable. We'll get back to riding soon enough and then we'll talk about the random car door, badly fit bike, or llama chase again.

_42
Whatever...Cliff Oates
Sep 13, 2001 5:05 PM
Doug, if you want to talk about bikes, then talk about bikes. You've just started a thread that talks about YOU. You are somewhat interesting in a curious sort of way, but...you're not a bike.

I am not here to explain myself. My political beliefs, my moral philosophy, they are not particularly relevant to anyone in this forum. To tell you the truth, I can and do find more stimulating non-bike related arguments elsewhere. I am here because I love riding and I love bikes, in my own way and mostly on my own terms. There is no greater meaning to be found here. Our love for bikes and riding is what brings us together.
damned if you do, damned if don't nmDog
Sep 13, 2001 5:25 PM
My feelings also...DINOSAUR
Sep 13, 2001 5:44 PM
I am finding it extrememly difficult to understand what is behind all these self centered posts. I'm not here to bore people with my political beliefs. Maybe some folks need a soap box or a platform but this is a cycling forum. I went for a ride today, which was terrible as all I could think about was those police and firemen that were running up the stairs of building #2 as people were running past them in the other direction in order to escape prior to it's collapse. When I arrived back home I clicked on the forum and the posts made me sick. Let's stop all this petty bickering and get back to bicycles. Nuff said...
I think we are all feeling the same.Largo
Sep 13, 2001 7:45 PM
Just expressing it in many different ways.
One day, we are all mostly friends on this forum, and the next, our politics are pushing us apart.
One thing i've always tried to do, is not hold my friends politics against them, just because they have a diferent view than me.
As the recent events have shown, friends can dissapear rather quickly.
Just got back from a great ride, and the day looked a whole lot better than it might have a few days ago.
Lets hope that those responcible are brought to justice, and that things don't escalate out of control to an end i would rather not contemplate.
Take care everyone.
Don't sweat itRod
Sep 14, 2001 8:23 AM
Doug,

So you've exposed your humanity. Congratulations, and don't sweat it. Yeah, this is a bicycle forum, but cycling seems pretty damn trivial in the aftermath of this week's attack. Given that, the off-topic threads about the attack and our perspectives on terrorism, and these terrorists in particular, seem quite appropriate on most any forum. I can see why Gregg has let them happen here. A similar thread developed at cyclingforum also, and probably for exactly the same reasons.

I think the threads validate that we're all on the same side, and like Americans do, we have diverse perceptions, and ways of expressing those perceptions. I observed unity in our collective outrage. I observed diverse perspectives regarding reaction to the attack and understanding the root causes that led up to the attack. I don't think the debate and argument regarding dissimilar perspectives was so terribly divisive. I think the debate can be seen as a part of our individual process of working through the outrage and grief we feel.

Cycling, along with my work, has seemed trivial to me this week, and I didn't ride Tuesday or Wednesday. I needed some exercise and had my fastest club ride of the season last night - and that on a route that includes one of our steeper hills. It felt really good.

Sincerely,

Rod