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Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?(46 posts)

Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?Dutchy
Sep 4, 2001 8:56 PM
This is an honest question.
I am not trolling.
This isn't one of those posts were two days later I'll say I was just posting for a reaction.
(enough for the disclaimers)

I live in Australia and have never seen a Litespeed being ridden. I have never seen one on sale here either. I was only made aware of them after reading about them on the internet.

I am curious as to why when ever the words Litespeed come up people become downright hostile. It seems some people love them and others think they are a POS.

People seem very passionate about their love/hate for Litespeed.

So my question is why do people have such strong reactions to this brand of bike? Does the company have some history I am not aware of?

I guess they are not sold in Australia due to a poor exchange rate. If they cost $3000 US that's about $6000 AUD.

CHEERS.
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?zzz
Sep 4, 2001 9:14 PM
hostile?? WHAT THE F$%# DO YOU MEAN!!!!! LITESPEEDS ARE MADE IN CHINA BY POLITICAL/CULTURAL SLAVES... no wait thats airborne...WELL.. THEY'RE MASS PRODUCED BY CAPITALIST WAR MONGERS...YEAH...AND THERE ARE SO MANY OF THEM THAT THEY ARE THREATENING THE ANARCHISTS WHO ARE MAKING TRUE WORKS OF ART IN TI. YEAH...AND oh what the he##..don't ever post that question again you aussie thug!!!!!!!!
got problems? nmAllen phx
Sep 4, 2001 9:24 PM
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?YAYA
Sep 4, 2001 9:31 PM
I have wondered the same thing. Why do people love to bash such a good bike company. If you notice, when people bash Litespeed, it is more often not about them riding poorly or being poorly made. They are excellent bikes, so one cannot really talk about them in terms of being junk (although a lemon can get by now and again in any company).
However, people seem to have a problem with the bikes because of what they represent. Some see them as elitist, poseur, yuppie machines (a yuppie is a person with money to burn, so they buy the most expensive things). I kind of understand this, but I am not willing to take it out on a bicycle company.
Others feel they are a marketing machine that sells an overrated product when their are so many other frames at cheaper prices that in their minds are more worth the money. I can see a trend over the last 2 years of Litespeed bashing. 4 or 5 years ago, people spoke about Litespeeds with respect and desire when they were a small company making bikes and they were really exclusive.
As with any product, once the masses take note and a company grows, some people feel they quality of th product suffers and the item loses its exclusiveness once more people start riding them. The fact is that Litespeeds are ridden in many professional races and are amongst the best bikes. I unfortunately cannot afford one right now, but I wish to have one soon.
You will be hard pressed to find a negative professional review of these bikes. Relying upon the owners themselves is hard because so may people like to justify their purchases but if they truly were not great bikes, Litespeed wouldn't have sold so many. I heard a statistic a few years ago that Litespeed was making about 75% of titanium frames in the world. This sounds crazy, but they were making them for other companies as well. Since then, there are more titanium manufacturers, but Litespeed is still huge in comparison.
I sent away for a brochure recently and the owner of the company hand signed the letters in the package. Now, this to me is a nice touch to stay connected to consumers. They have also answered my emails immediately and I don't even own one yet. So tis image that they are a huge inattentive company seems false to me based upon my experience.
I think the negative sentiment is bizarre that Litespeed evokes from some here. The supporters are just as bad as if they had stock in the company. I do agree though that the bashing is often unfounded and possibly envy on the part of some. Even if I had a Colnago c40, I would love to have a Litespeed Vortex as well. It would be nice to have any high end bike to try or have for that matter. There may be better values, but when you factor in the potential longevity of a good titanium frame, the value meters tilts in its favor.
This topic should start a war, but I just don't know why as I rarley see Litespeed supporters bashing other rides. Just an observation but I could be wrong.
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?zzz
Sep 4, 2001 9:55 PM
well said. there are so many good frames out there that we should feel great about the selection we have. won't there always be people who want to be derogatory about something. if a product is truly badly made and overpriced it will not survive. the news of that will surface in a much larger way than the simple-minded rantings of those people who just want to be obnoxious.
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?badabill
Sep 5, 2001 5:03 AM
Could not say it any better. Here in San Diego you see more Litespeeds than just about any brand. Here the bashing comes from the Merlin, Seven, Holland crowd, who spend even more for Ti. Litespeed has changed from a boutique builder to a large manufacturer, so people will bash that success.
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?davet
Sep 4, 2001 10:01 PM
Ya'know, I can't really tell you why some people are bashing Litespeed. I own a Serotta Hors' Categorie, which in my mind is the absolute pinnacle of Ti bike building, but I would not consider criticizing a fellow riders Litespeed. I had my reasons for purchasing my Serotta, which in my mind were the best reasons in the world. And I'm sure Litespeed owners would say the same thing. We could argue the relative merits of each. Ride each others bikes for comparison, and then discuss what we like or don't like about the bikes. Comparing bikes is great fun when done intelligently. Sometimes small minds don't know how to disagree or argue positive and negative merits without resorting to namecalling and trashing. I think sometimes people like to hide behind a keyboard and vent their daily frustrations anywhere convenient. And too, maybe it's the fact that the people who bash the loudest simply can't afford what they really want and resort to condeming it. Sort of a "If I can't have it, I don't want you to have it either".
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?Avanti Guy
Sep 5, 2001 3:16 AM
Have a look at http://www.bicycleexoticadirect.com.au/home.htm .
They are the local Aussie dealers of Litespeed, Merlin, Kestrel and Lew Wheels...
I am actually looking at breaking open the piggy bank and getting some Lew wheels :)...
Even though its off topic, anyone out there own a set of Lew Palermo's? They seem pretty darned spiffy to me...
Sorry to stray there, but check it out, and yes you are right, with the bad exchange rates bike stuff is pretty expensive here.
Litespeeds are great bikes any way you cut itChris Zeller
Sep 5, 2001 7:04 AM
Litespeeds are great bikes and surely one of the top bike builders--so are Serrotta, Merlin and Seven. Arguing about which one is better is rather pedantic, but typical of people who spend too much money and time fine tuning every aspect of their bikes. I think people who have a specific personal prefrence for a specific manufacture sometimes confuse saying, "I like X bike better than Y bike" with, "X bike is great and Y bike sucks."

I myself like Airborne bikes because I think they give a better value than Litespeeds and in many ways are just as good. But truth be told, I'd take a Litespeed (if I bought the frame and selected the parts like I did with my Airborne) over my Airborne any day if they weren't so dang expensive.
Litespeeds are great bikes any way you cut itJon Billheimer
Sep 5, 2001 7:52 AM
I wholeheartedly agree with all of the above. I know several guys who ride Litespeeds and they
have nothing but praise for the bikes. If I could afford one I'd buy it in a heartbeat! The only negative
comments (valid ones, that is) I've heard about Litespeed is that their service leaves something to
be desired. They've gotten so big so fast they haven't kept up with demand very well.

It seems to be a trend among some people that as soon as a company becomes successful it
is de rigeur to criticize it. This somehow places the critics, in their own minds at least, in more
esoteric and knowledgeable company. Noticed all the Trek bashing since USPS popularized the
brand?
one reasonraleighRacer
Sep 5, 2001 8:06 AM
There's a guy around here that rides an older not even close to topline LS- classic or something- with 105 or ultegra components, and he's got a sticker on it that says "your bike sucks". What an elitist jack@ass.
I'm sure all at Litespeed would agree with...RhodyRider
Sep 5, 2001 8:26 AM
...your asessment of this boob. And I think I am safe in saying that he is neither a spokesman for nor an employee of Litespeed, nor is he a typical example of a Litespeed owner (or any reasonable bike owner). He is just what you labeled him, a random jackass. He shouldn't ever be perceived as emblematic of Litespeed. He is simply emblematic of an arrogant jerk.
I'm sure all at Litespeed would agree with...Atomicwedgie
Sep 5, 2001 9:16 AM
OR, he may just have a sense of humor.
It's not the bike, it's the riderLC
Sep 5, 2001 9:25 AM
I know that I am generalizing here but, for some reason Litespeed bikes seem to attract jerks. Kind of like how a Mercedes car seems to do the same thing to their drivers. They like to flaunt their Titanium bikes like a Rolex watch.

I have no problem with someone driving a Mercedes wearing a Rolex, but it's not usually the kind of person I want to hand out with.
My 3 reasons (longish)terry_b
Sep 5, 2001 10:25 AM
Firstly, regardless of whether someone can easily afford an LS or not, they seem to me to be hugely overpriced. A Vortex, from an internet vendor lists for 2950 without a fork. A Pinarello Opera, with a fork and a headset is 1000 less. I for one can't see +1400 (with fork and HS) as a reasonable delta between those two based on performance. Personally I'd rather ride the Italian steel.

Secondly, to me LSs are kind of like Corvettes - any jamook with the money can walk into any Chevy dealer and walk out with a performance automobile. It does not take any taste or discernment or research to buy such a car yet vehicles with a great deal more cachet and performance exist in the same price range. You sort of end up with an "everyman's" product that says more about your wallet and less about your taste or interests. Seems to me like an easy, no risk way of saying, "I've got some bucks" to the population of people who have not attempted to appreciate something more exotic. I'll bet if I go and park my Pinarello outside the LBS LS dealer, half of those walking in to buy a LS are going to say, "wow" while the other half won't even know it from a Huffy. Bearing in mind however that the LBS LS dealer is a mulit-sport department store catering to the better neighborhoods in my city.

Now, do taste and discernment have anything to do with a bicycle's performance? Of course not, this is really just about the snob value of this bike or that. Which brings me to my third reason - part of what I like about riding is appreciating other people's bikes and frankly, I get bored looking at all those Litespeeds. My first thought when I see one is (relating to reason 2), "there goes another person with the means and not the taste." Am I a bad person, you betcha. Am I wrong in most cases, no doubt. I'm positive there are lots of informed, talented cyclists that bought that bike based on comparison shopping and its performance. I'll also bet there are plenty that walked into the above LBS and said, "give me your most expensive bike because I can afford it." However the right intentions don't matter in my case since the LS speaks only one way to me. And it's easy to be a bike bigot with all the opportunities I get to exercise my prejudice.

I'm sure Litespeeds are great bikes, and God Bless them for putting so many on the road. They're just not for me (and apparently many others) and my Europhile checkbook.

In the end I'm sure there is no cogent, convincing argument about why they're inferior or superior. Every bike has stories of crappy welds, split seams, burrs in the BB shell, crummy customer service. Rather I think it's a matter of whether you like looking at them or not and what they say to you when you see them.
You must have been dropped by one.k
Sep 5, 2001 11:52 AM
I detected some bitterness in your essay. Nothing wrong with not liking the company. I guess I look at making judgements about others based on what they ride as a missed opportunity of meeting some cool people. If you want to be critical of other riders, just let your skills do the talking. There's plenty of Litespeeds at local criterium races.
bitterness? not meterry_b
Sep 5, 2001 12:23 PM
Nope, none of that - I've been dropped by LSs and I've dusted a few myself. Besides, one does not get dropped by a bike, one gets dropped by a rider and as I said in my post - I have no doubts that there are many highly skilled riders riding LSs. As to meeting cool people, don't often have the opportunity to stop and chat while riding although recently I did hook up with a guy on a Vortex who invited me to join him for a ride out to the country. Cool guy and a good rider. Did it change my mind about LS, no. Did it change my mind about that one guy, yep. even a bike bigot like me can be flexible. I would never say, "no thanks, I don't ride with LS riders" to someone who invited me to join them. By the way, that's what prejudices are all about, having your mind changed by people who don't fit your preconceived notion.
Terry-bLazyrider
Sep 5, 2001 1:40 PM
You are an idiot. Not one reason you gave was about the inherent quality or lack thereof in a litespeed. Your reasons for disliking them are as superficial as the guy who walks in a buys one only because it is the most expensive bike in the shop.
I beg to differ on the price thing as well as I see many high end aluminum and steel bikes pushing the cost envelope very close to quality titanium. There are plenty of opportunities to ride a litespeed for 3-4 grand. That is about where many high end bikes are, yet titanium will outlast most other materials, particularly steel and aluminum. So the value argument is moot.
You are of that faction of people that think that just because something has become popular, it is no longer desirable. It is no secret here that I ride a Litespeed for over 4 years, way before their explosion in sales. Every European cycling magazines rave about Litespeed. Go figure. The funny thing is that I understand the lust for a classic european frame. I have one (Fondriest) and it doesn't hold a candle to the Litespeed. I would say if it were so, I am the owner of both and want to think I bought the best bike for me, but I know for sure that the Litespeed is superior to the Fondriest.
Another thing, I don't ride my bike to park it outside the LBS to have people say "WOW" like you seem to enjoy. That is not why I ride. Pinarellos are fine bikes, but I saw a fat slob riding one the other day decked out with $300 worth of clothing. Near me, most litespeed riders seem younger and more fit than that big giggly ass. So should I keep that image forever of Pinarellos? No, you are ignorant, i am not.
thanks for confirming my opinionterry_b
Sep 5, 2001 2:25 PM
Never attempted to discuss the quality of a LS, I think I made it clear I think they're great bikes.

My reasons are absolutely superficial, I think I made that clear too. I was answering the original post which asked the question of why they are controversial. Appears to me that most anit-LS sentiment is superficial, just like mine. Doesn't make it wrong, just makes it superficial.

You're right, I do think things that are popular can be less desirable. I think when things become popular people start liking them because they're popular, not because they're good things or because they've taken the time to form an opinion of their own. And no, you don't need to apologize to me because you bought your bike before they became popular. You made a good choice and you seem willing to defend it.

No, I don't park my Pinarello outside the department store that sells LSs. That was a hypothetical example and you missed the point. Thinking hypothetically can be tough, that's why we're not all physicists.

"Near me most LS riders seem younger and more fit" Younger is better? "More fit", who's working the generalizations now? Talk about superficial conclusions. Funny, most of the LS riders I see are middle-aged guys like me. Guess the young people in your neighborhood have more money.

One last question for you, are you capable of having a discussion without insulting someone? Starting your post with, "You're an idiot" really says a lot more about you than it does about me. It also doesn't do you much service in making your arguments more convincing. The vitriole that you use to defend your ride makes me wonder about you. Did you really make the right bike choice? To butcher (paraphrase) the immortal words of the Bard, "m'lady doth protest too much."
O.K. I am sorry I called you an idiot.Lazyrider
Sep 5, 2001 2:58 PM
You're a douchebag. As far as my ability to understand hypotheticals, look in the mirror. My point about the fat guy on the Pinarello was that I will not judge all people I subsequently see by that experience. I think I was clear in my last statement. It was an example of your own ignorant judgements.
You think you can quote some trite line and come across as intelligent. Not by my standards. You should come up with some more esoteric and less obvious quotes if your going to act like some pseudo-intellectual.
As far as popularity affecting the inherent quality of something, you prove to me you are one of those elitist people that need to have anything different for difference sake. Like when people like a song. As soon as too many people begin to enjoy it, your type tends to see it as played out when in fact it was the same song that touched you in the first place. The song is inherently the same, but it has lost its " importance". See that is an analogy!
An analogy for why people now hate LS or Trek or C'dale. Their too common therefore they are bad is your logic. Faulty logic at that.
Guess that answers terry_b's question:Mike
Sep 5, 2001 4:10 PM
"One last question for you, are you capable of having a discussion without insulting someone?"
You Win!terry_bq
Sep 5, 2001 4:43 PM
Silliest Person on Roadbikereview.com. I'll even take second place for being silly enough to waste my time and that of the others here, talking to you.

"Douchebag", thanks again. Not only did you prove my point but you gave me a free trip down Memory Lane. Haven't been called that since 1967, hanging with my 7th grade buds. Are you in 7th grade?

By the way, "elitist" and "psuedo-intellectual" are labels I will gladly accept if it means not having to pollute my life with people who think "douchebag" is a rejoinder to be used in a public forum.

Sorry to the rest of you reading this for spinning up yet another petty tyrant. I guess that's the price of honesty in this electronic age.
Lazy just proved LC's theory is correct!who's the douchebag?
Sep 5, 2001 5:01 PM
If I had a Litespeed I would sell it... what an ass. A total embarassment. Get a life.
Who's the idiot?Rod
Sep 5, 2001 3:55 PM
Lazyrider,

I found your post offensive, and if I hadn't found the thread itself interesting, it's the kind of post I would usually ignore. Are you having a bad day or something? I don't know Terry B, and I don't know if he is a genius, but his credible post - unlike yours - is indicative that he's no idiot, and most likely not even ignorant.

The issue here isn't even whether LS are "good" or "bad." The topic is why LS threads elicit so much controversy, which this thread did not - until you chimed in. You would have had far more credibility with me had you simply extolled the virtues of LS - as you see them - then by bashing Terry B, whose apparent offense was to give his explanation of why LS threads are controversial.

Unless I observe more relavent input from your posts, I'll know that you're one of the individuals who reduces the overall value of the bulletin board with inane content, and I'll know to skip those posts.

Sincerely,

Rod
Hey Rod....Lone Gunman
Sep 5, 2001 4:16 PM
He's just pissed because someone spotted the "your bike sucks" sticker on his Litespeed.
Hey Rod....mackgoo
Sep 6, 2001 7:23 AM
The guy was expressing "HIS" opinion, ergo "CREDIBLE". He was honest, he himself labled himself a bike biggot. I think we all have agreed Litespeeds are nice bikes. So if so.....back to the origonal post.
Rod, what post are you reading?Lazyrider
Sep 5, 2001 4:22 PM
Did you read his original post? It wasn't an objective response to the original question, it was his own prejudicial take on why he hates LS. Read it again and tell me it was "credible". I am yet to hear objective information on why LS sucks. I am sick of hearing about the "image" they represent. That says nothing about the bicycle in and of itself.
Notice that there aren't many people who own LS saying "my bike is the best or better than yours". Then, they would deserve what they get. However, if someone mentions they ride one, invariably some jerko$$ will chime in about how they are shi$$y yuppie machines blah blah.
In fact I even seen a couple of people afraid to admit that they ride LS in fear of reactions from you idiots. FU$K You people. Like I said, it is a bicycle company, no more no less. Bashers invariably initiate the debate by uninstigated bashing, not LS owners.
Terry-b's response was a thinly veiled opportunity to bash LS based upon his observations of the "type" of person that a LS owner must be. If you agree with that logic of judging others based upon not knowing the individual but passing judgement nonetheless, then join the KKK, they are looking for some new recruits.
Prejudicial thinking is ignorant and Terry-b admitted he prejudged others for what they ride. What an idiot and I am afraid you are too Rod if you agree with that way of thinking.
Lazyrider, you're a psycho.nm
Sep 5, 2001 5:11 PM
nm
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?Rev. Litespeed
Sep 5, 2001 11:07 AM
I bought mine (a used Natches with full Ultegra, Speedplays, and a Flightdeck) for less then any 105 bike I could find. It is odd though how people react just because it says Litespeed. There are many bikes I would rather have. However, I am happy with the bike. It was made close to where I live and rides nice. I could live with out the comments though.
re: Why are "Litespeeds" so controversial?mackgoo
Sep 5, 2001 2:03 PM
Personaly I think they must be, don't know first hand, nice bikes and at least I don't think I bash em. One thing I've noticed though and for me this could be a reason.I am relatively new to this board been checking it out and commenting for about a month. It just seems that, and maybe it's only one person I never really investigated, but any way, we always have to be made aware of "such and such is a Litespeed" or "so and so rides a Litespeed" and it just get's sort of boring as well as you have to start wondering if they continually have to justify the bike then well... I guess it doesn't speak for it self.
But now maybe actually I can relate. You see I'm a Campyholic, and ocasionally I will pasionately relate the superior qualities of Campy components, other times I will impishly just throw in a jab or two knowing how upset it get's people. Which I admit is childish and not nice. I think I'll tone that down. Anyway maybe that's what these Litespeed guy's in particular are doing too.
Now a Litespeed with Record, that would be a bike;).
Good pointMike
Sep 5, 2001 2:31 PM
I don't have strong feelings one way or the other about Litespeed. A good friend of mine has a four year old Ultimate and he really likes it. However, I can't imagine that he'd go if nuts someone said something bad about his bike. If it makes him happy, that's all that matters. Around here, whenever someone criticizes Litespeed, some Litespeed owners go ballistic. We have to see re-posts of articles about so-and-so riding a rebadged Litespeed in such-and-such race and hear about how great the bikes really are. The shrill tone of much of the Litespeed defense simply seems to egg on the Litespeed detractors, creating a vicious cycle. Many happy Litespeed owners out there (e.g., Kerry Irons) wisely let this material pass without comment. Maybe others on both sides of the debate can learn from them. Litespeed lovers aren't going to convince the bashers that they're great bikes and bashers aren't going to convince owners to trade in for a Colnago, De Rosa, or Pinarello.
Good pointmackgoo
Sep 5, 2001 5:42 PM
Heh, what about Bianchi.
Maybe we should save that for another thread ;-) (nm)Mike
Sep 5, 2001 7:20 PM
nm
my speculationDog
Sep 5, 2001 3:32 PM
This is my speculation as to the controversy:

1. They are expensive. Nearly anything expensive will be controversial. Many people will think they are over priced and purchased only for conspicuous consumption. A form of class envy is involved, too.

2. They are not (outwardly) ridden by Division I pro teams. Many people find justification for their purchases in pro sponsorships. Without one, an expensive bike is seen as a yuppie status symbol (not saying I agree, just trying to understand the controversy).

3. They, according to many people's observations, are frequently purchased by those knowing little about bikes, but with plenty of money and wanting "the best." I've seen this first hand. A guy with no cycling experience at all, but making good money, buys a new Ultimate, outfits it with triple Ultregra and a 1 gallon seatbag, and then boasts about how great his bike s. Who cares? You are slow, dangerous, and obnoxious. This was my first hand experience, and seems to be somewhat prevalent.

4. They are (mostly) unpainted. To me, being somewhat of a traditionalist, a bike should have some personality. Raw Ti, despite it's superior functionality (great for mountainbikes), is very bland. Hard to get excited about grey, especially when there are so many other bikes on the road that look just like it. Heck, a Litespeed looks just like an Airborne (no throwing bottles at me, please).

5. Litespeed touts itself as superior with engineering details of this or that, octagon shaped tubes, special welding, etc. Still, a bike's a bike. I think they over-market the technical stuff, which likely appeals to the well-paid engineer types more so than what pro team rides what bike.

To me, basically a bike is a bike. The variations and distinctions are very small, but we seem to make a big deal out of them. Really no need for any bike to be controversial, short of being $10,000 and gold plated. Bottom line, it's a big deal made out of nothing.

Dog
my speculation--mostly correctChris Zeller
Sep 5, 2001 3:43 PM
I think you're correct in saying a bike is a bike and this is a whole big deal made out of nothing--but then you turn around and bash another good manufacturer.

Supposedly the fact that a Litespeed looks like an Airborne is a huge insult since there is some percieved huge performance difference.

Make up your mind.
looks like...Dog
Sep 5, 2001 4:07 PM
Ok, they both look nice. Didn't intend to insult Airbornes.

Dog
thanks for saying it too.terry_b
Sep 5, 2001 4:47 PM
Good job with the articulation, a more concise version of what I was trying to say.
Too bad they have that image problemSkunkWorks
Sep 5, 2001 6:26 PM
Some of the biggest jerks I can think of just happen to have a Litespeed. But there is one decient guy that road the same old bike for 20 years and he finally saved up for a Litespeed and will probally ride that for 20 years. I feel sorry for him because now the titanium @holes come up to him and like to posture thier penis length, stock portfolio, engine horse power, ect. I bet he removes the Litespeed stickers very soon and puts a Huffy sticker in its place to keep the jerks away.
anyone we know? does it start with Lazy?and end in rider?
Sep 5, 2001 6:49 PM
nm
My statement , YouLazyrider
Sep 5, 2001 7:57 PM
people act like Litespeed is like a communist uprising.
I could care less what you peole think of me. Trust me, I will sleep just fine tonight. I came on this board trying to be as helpful as others and when I posted my picture of my ride, I got slammed by you bashers,uninstigated. I never bash other bikes, so my reaction is what I choose it to be. Now I say Fuc$ all of you. I recognize logic and legitimate arguments, but those presented about Litespeed are usually superficial and just silly.
Where I live, the yuppie elitists are all riding Serotta and Seven now. Both are fine bikes, but mark my words all you jerko##s will inevitably criticize them if they ever reach the same level of success as LS.
You support Terry B's conclusion of LS owners because you are on the basher bandwagon. I am sure their are LS owners here that totally disagree with your gross generalizations of the type of people we are who ride LS but choose not to mark themselves to avoid future disagreements. It is propoganda, Hitler was also successful at promoting that. I know that my bike is great for me. YOur comments don't affect that. However, your moronic conclusions about LS owners is childish and pathetic.

My aggressive nature didn't come out until I was severely criticized just for owning a LS. I will not apologize, in fact I say to you emphatically FU(K YOU ALL.
You're an angry man, JeffreyMike
Sep 5, 2001 8:21 PM
You seem to lose any semblance of reason when anyone criticizes a Litespeed. Anyone who doesn't love Litespeed is a basher in your book and, apparently, that justifies name-calling, profanity, and comparison to Hitler. Do you really expect anyone to take your opinions seriously when you use fu(k, queer, idiot, @$$hole, and jerk0&&s in almost every post? My impression is that most people wonder what motivates a person when he responds so angrily. Obviously, you're not going to change your tone, but just don't expect to change any minds or even be read with a straight face with such venomous posts. And before you accuse me of Litespeed-bashing, see my previous post on the subject: I've never spent any time on one and have no postive or negative feelings about them.
Who's Jeffrey?Lazyrider
Sep 5, 2001 9:22 PM
No mike, I get angry when people make unwarranted assumptions about a group of people based upon such a ridiculous and superficial thing like the kind of BIKE they own. I know I have a sharp tongue to say the least, but fu(k it that is who I am. No apologies.
I could care less if someone doesn't like a bike or not. There are more important things int his world. However, I cannot stand the gross generaliztions about the type of person one must be if they ride a certain bike and the fact that I rarely see any dialogue on actual concrete and legitmate problems with the bike. All flamebait. The fact that someone cannot ask an innocent question about the bike without a barrage of insults says more abut others than me.
You don't see me saying Colnago sucks or Pinarellos blow. Who cares!!! Only LS.
Who is Jeffrey by the way? Sure not me. How are you doing Mr Mcmahom?
By the way!Lazyrider
Sep 5, 2001 9:33 PM
As far as you guys that say you are sick of this argument. This thread has been viewed 1700 or so times. Obviously people want to see this discussion.
they are laughing at your postsdeke
Sep 6, 2001 12:29 PM
so comical it's sad
And the answer is...............Redir Yzal
Sep 5, 2001 10:01 PM
Litespeeds suck because they charge waaaaaaaaaaay too much for what you get. $300-400 in materials and $1000 to $3000 more for the mediocre craftsmanship, glossy catalogs and full page ads in all the rags. For years they hyped the superiority of titanium over aluminum and now they build aluminum bikes. Aluminum bikes made in Taiwan to increase the margins.

Airborne (Huffy) sucks because they're made in China by a bunch of twelve year olds and they triple the price of the frame for resale without adding any value. Want to save 3 or 4 or 500 dollars on an Airborne frame? Just buy direct though any number of overseas contract frame sweatshops. XI'AN CHANGDA TITANIUM PRODUCTS CO.,LTD is a big fave for producing supercheap titanium bikes as is BIAM. Airborne makes a killing by being an importer with a catchy name and marketing the allure of titanium to the gullible.

And finally, Lazyrider sucks because of the vacuum that exists between his ears.
STOP THE MADNESSjaybird
Sep 6, 2001 6:26 AM
OK, let's get one thing straight. Opinions are like a$$holes, we all have them and they all stink... Granted, Litespeeds do have an elitist reputation, maily because of the wealthier people in society that know anything about bikes, ride them. so what? I am flattered that all of these people want to be part of my community...

Don't sweat the petty things, just pet the sweatty things...

now quit yer bichin, get your ass on your bike, whatever it is, and Fu(king Ride it...

much love,
J.