|Euro Road Bikes||Markdown|
Jul 24, 2001 7:25 AM
|I have a buddy that is living in Germany and looking for a new road bike. He has looked at a couple that I haven't heard of, Cube and Chaka. They are AL frames with 105 componemts. They run around $900 in Freiburg. I found the Cube website, and it looks like a generic alloy frame, nothing special, but at 900 it sounds like a reasonable deal.
My question: Does anyone here live in Europe? What does a Pinarello Surprise run in Italy or Germany? The $900 deal sounds a lot cheaper than bikes used to be in Europe. Whats the deal? What does some of the familiar US bikes run over there? Say a Trek or Specialized or Lemond with 105? What kind of "good" bike could my bud pick up for a grand in Europe?
|Treks in Italy||Jack S|
Jul 24, 2001 7:27 AM
|run about 1-1/2 to 2 x retail compared to US prices|
|re: Euro Road Bikes||mmaggi|
Jul 24, 2001 7:30 AM
If you don't see a price, e-mail Alesandro and he'll be more than happy to answer your questions.
Jul 24, 2001 8:15 AM
|You say your buddy's living in Germany. If he's staying there, he'll have to pay the VAT which is 18.5%. |
If he's a US citizen and returning soon, he can get a VAT receipt and then get the VAT refunded but he will be liable for import duty into the US due to US Customs.
US bikes will be more expensive in Europe as they will reflect the import duty plus the VAT which is based on the importer's cost plus the VAT.
If he's staying in Germany for any length of time, the best thing for him to do as it relates to value is buy a bike made in the EU. Thereby he eliminates any import duty and also reduces the basis on which the VAT is calculated.
If he has a US credit card, he can also do some arbitraging of currency differences between the $ and the DM, ITL, etc.
Most of the German manufacturers are mass producers without any higher end bikes. You might try posting an inquiry to Thomas Villadsen at as he lives in Germany and knows quite a bit about high end bikes and is in-country.
As for Italy, MMaggi's suggestion is a good one. Romeo's in Roma but make sure your friend indicates how he likes his VAT, included or excluded, when asking for prices. There's also another person at this site who lives in Milano and helped me out when I was going to the Vigorelli Velodrome to see Alberto Masi who you can probably find using search under Milano or Masi.
|how did your visit with Alberto go (nm)||mmaggi|
Jul 24, 2001 11:05 AM
|He's a very nice man||zelig1|
Jul 25, 2001 1:02 AM
|Dragged my wife up there on a Saturday morning (payback for all the shoes she bought)just to see the Velodrome, under external renovation and not open, and on the off chance that the shop was open. In 1969 a friend of mine had a made to measure Masi built by Faliero so it was one of those visits you always think about but rarely realise. |
Well the shop was open and Alberto was there. As the Giro was on, he was reading La Gazzetta dello Sport. Chatted briefly with him and he just let me wander around the shop which is neat but fairly small. The walls are lined with cycling legends going back to the late 40's, early 50's. Both road and track. There were a fair number of Masi's, both old and new as well as his current offering which is branded Milano in the US. He's really quite happy keeping the business small and not going the route that Pinarello, Colnago or even Derosa and Basso have gone. He's working in both steel and Al, lugged (external and internal) and Tig'd although he is not yet making any Al with carbon in the rear stays. Finish on the new products was excellent, contrary to postings at various sites on the web. He did leave open the possibility of making a lugged, steel Masi using the old style decals as I don't live in the States. He then left me to look around and went outside to wash his car. He's pretty laid back.
I'm back in Milano for the next two weeks so I may call him to see about a frame although I don't have the space in London and have too many bikes in the States. Nice problems to have.
|re: Euro Road Bikes||sergei|
Jul 25, 2001 1:21 AM
|In my opinion it would stupid to buy an american bike in Europe, as prices for american and japanese parts and bikes are higher than ever due to currency exchange rates. |
Germany does have some manufacturers of high-end bikes, it's just that they don't have the same reputation as the italians.
As for reputation: I subscribe to a german cycling magazine which does extensive testing on bikes and frames in every price range each year, and I've seen many of those so-called 'exclusive' bikes and frames being smoked by much cheaper and unknown manufacturers.
One that's always ahead in the tests is Canyon, check them out at www.canyon.de and look for the 'Passione' series, you can't get better value than this in Germany.