|Looking for a fast 30-32mm road use tire||Jan Gerrit Klok|
Jan 22, 2003 2:13 PM
|Building up a Surly Pacer, a steel road bike with just that little extra tire clearance while using normal short-reach road brakes. 32mm is reported to be the limit for tires. I'd like to commute and do tarmac crits on the bike, and if it fits, why not get a fatter tire? I appreciate my comfort and have always found 23c tires to be too darn narrow and bouncy.
I'd prefer a light folding tire that still offers extra grip/confidence in 24-32mph tarmac corners, also wet. Anyway, the tire will be heavy enough to give me an extra workout trying to finish those crits. I also plan to use the bike as a singlespeed, if I pull it off.
Thanks a lot for your ideas!!
|re: Looking for a fast 30-32mm road use tire||hummu|
Jan 22, 2003 2:48 PM
|Try the Rolly Polly from Rivendell Bicycle Works . Also available from Harris Cyclery . |
Wide, plush, grippy, round profile, lightish at 290 g. I like mine.
|Tufo diamond tread tubular or tub/ clincher||buffalosorrow|
Jan 22, 2003 4:41 PM
|I finaly finished my colnago for my final race of the season. I ran a tufo c-diamond 28 tubular clincher in the front and a c- prestige 30 on the rear. It was cold and windy, typical for
long island. There was a 10 meter patch of tight snow, not yet cut into for the B race, I decided to run it. I was extremly pleased with the tires. I felt quite fast in the sandy backwoods, I placed my best of the season.
I think the diamond tufo's are hard to find, but well worth it. Avail in 28-30-32mm's.
|Tufo diamond tread tubular or tub/ clincher||Jan Gerrit Klok|
Jan 22, 2003 10:52 PM
I used to be the local Tufo guy here, popably still have some diamonds left. I once raced the LPS Diamonds, the yellow ones, and those were an absolute blast on the dry grassy course. Rolled like mad on the road, but that doesn't mean they're good racing the middle of the pack in a road crit. Somehow I did like the C T30 knobby for tarmac training. Even at racing speed the knobbies gripped well on the local crit course. They however don't roll very well obviously, being full knobby cross tires.
I like the Rivendell idea, as well as Vredestien as I happen to be Dutch. Will look into both of them.
I never understood quite why roadies always had to run 19-23c tires, even in the worst of conditions. I'm sure on a cross bike, you'd have an edge in Paris Roubaix and simular races. No way I'll ever ride there with anything less than 28mm. 30mm LPD Diamonds would be the key to success, IMO.
Any documented cases of a roadie taking the smart route by running fatties on a mesy course?
|Tufo diamond tread tubular or tub/ clincher ON THE ROAD?||atpjunkie|
Jan 23, 2003 11:45 AM
|he's asking for a road use tire. don't waste those Tufo's on the pavement.|
|re: Looking for a fast 30-32mm road use tire||toomanybikes|
Jan 22, 2003 9:02 PM
|Vredestein Campo Cross.
28 / 30 or 32
|re: Rivendell||HENRY K|
Jan 23, 2003 5:15 AM
|I tried the Rolly-Pollys from Rivendell last year. Maybe the best road tire I ever had. The mold is in 3 pieces instead of the usual 2 so the tire ends up rounder with more air volume great cornering great ride. Great tire!
The only drawback for me is the beige colored side wall. But Rivendell claims that it is done that way so that you can see if the air is down.
|re: Rivendell||Jan Gerrit Klok|
Jan 23, 2003 7:26 AM
|So would you actually advice me to do 25-35mph crits on those tires? My belief in bike brand's designers *cough* tells me there must be SOMS reason "everyone" rides tiny 19-23c tires, never bigger.
$45 plus trans-Atlantic shipping and duties is a bit steep for the budget bike I'm planning. Wonder if I could get them through Panaracer and the shop I kinda work...
What tire comes closest, if any? I'm kinda tall and clumsy for riding a road bike competitively (6'4" and a mountainbiker), if there's extra ground clearance (for my 185mm cranks) and grip to be had with running bigger tires it might just be worth it to me.
Why do you use words as "tried" and "had", don't you want them anymore now, stop road riding, worn them out too fast to your liking?
Jan 23, 2003 8:07 AM
|Ok, so I can't quote sources, but I believe there are studies saying that a wider tire has less rolling resistance than a skinny tire. The wider tire rolls over road irregularities and keeps contact with the ground while the skinny tire bounces off of the irregularities. The skinny tire transmits more road shock to the rider, so the rider "feels" he/she is going faster. |
Another advantage of the wider tire is more resistance to pinch flats. Which tire is faster, the skinny, hard, "racing" tire that is flat, or the wide, soft, recreational tire that just rolls right through that bad patch of pavement on the crit course?
Jan, maybe you can get your shop to get you some Rolly Pollies from Panaracer (or their distributor) as Harris Cyclery has done. If not, I think Grant Peterson had the Avocet Fas Grip, and/or the Panaracer Cat. Pro in mind when he was designing the R.P.
The only reason I wouldn't race on the R.P. is if my bike didn't have clearance to run them. My road bike is a Vitus 979 and I have minimal clearance with the R.P. at the chainstays. A 25 mm tire gives me a little more wobble room which might come in handy for that bad patch of pavement. I'll put them on my Proctor for road rides, though. And if I ever get a custom lugged road racer a la Dede Barry's Mariposa, I'll make sure that it can handle wide tires.
|re: Rivendell||Jan Gerrit Klok|
Jan 23, 2003 11:41 AM
|Yes, I've heard rumours that the 26x2.35"Schwalbe Big Apple On The Beach is in fact the best rolling tire out there. Could well be.
At Harris the tire is listed as Panaracer, I'll give them a shot. The thing sounds promising, being designed with so much heart for the sport.
SS or not, if the Pacer becomes a success and tire clearance suffices for 32mm cross tires, I may not be able to keep myself from christening it off-road.
In a race.
Like sunday's Super Prestige course in Hoogstraten, Belgium. Last year it was all cork dry needle forest soil, flowing singletrack, loose sand and soms roots. I'd be slower on a single gear, but it'd be fun! Probably best to try sports with this setup, not to be lapped after the 2nd lap.
|185's in a crit?||atpjunkie|
Jan 23, 2003 12:02 PM
|first get those cranks off. You'll be hitting the ground pedaling corners in a crit and cause great crashes. Gerrit I'm 6'4" 230 and probably fall into the semi-clumsy (I ride road, MTB and cross) category. I race road on 23 Michelin Axials and they are fine. for straight road use, go no bigger than a 27. Anything over IMHO is overkill and will only slow you down. All these "theories" of larger tires being faster is a load of crap. Check a local pro race or the big times, the only time they use 27's (huge for road use) is Paris-Roubaix. If running 30's was faster they'd be using them in the pro peloton. If you are heavy the Vredstein Fortezzas can run 145 psi which will help as well. Yes, the ride is a little more harsh but it is faster. Friction is friction and the smaller the contact patch, the less friction, the faster you go. Bail on the pseudo science and seriously save those 185' s for TTing|
|185's in a crit?ps||atpjunkie|
Jan 23, 2003 2:55 PM
|ps. if you are a bit "clumsy" on a roadie do plenty of group rides at speed before entering a crit. A race-speed crit peloton is no place to learn how to ride in a group. You will save yourself (and most likely a group of others) a whole lot of hurt. Slamming asphalt at 30 mph and getting hit and run over by 10-15 riders is no way to break into road racing|
|185's in a crit?ps||Jan Gerrit Klok|
Jan 24, 2003 2:06 AM
|Thanks for looking out for me!
I've done lots of training crits on closed circuits and some actual around-the-church sports/elite crits, all on my behated Giant TCR. The 185mm cranks were no problem on that bike, BB drop was perhaps a little better than average.
I've hit pedals, but also with 172.5mm. The 185mm's make more sence to guys like us, but it takes a lot of getting used to. People warn me about my low cadance at times, but that simply comes with the longer cranks, at lower rpm I'm not necessarily pushing.
Okay, most crits are climb-free, but I really like that about long cranks, much easier to transfer my might to the rear wheel. As these are the road cranks I have, I hoped to re-use them on the Surly Pacer that essentially was meant to replace the Giant 1250g-flex-o-rama frame and "uh-oh" carbon fork. Going to the bigger tires I hope will give me confidence and a CX-like comfort would be a welcome way to give me some extra ground cleareance.
I use Eggbeater pedals now, and am still looking for affordable Bebop cleats, so my pedals are compensating for some of the bad Q-factor my road bike is bound to have.
I've had near-crashes in crits, once I dropped the chain off the crainring at 31-32mph exiting a tarmac corner. I took off and landed on the low toptube the way it hurts most... I don't do road racign as a prime sport because I'm not looking forward to actually hitting the surface while riding a pack. I'll just eat dirt when I mess up in an mtb race, thank you very much!
I'm bad at crits, always end up in the last wheel and struggling to keep up, while I would kick 90%-100% of the pack's a$$ in an offroad event, my muscles don't understand road racing very well. Trying some training crits singlespeed will be an interesting experience to say the least!
Last summer I left the TCR home and rode the CX racer. I learned I don't need a super-short chainstay, I didn't feel like a truck at all, rather al little more stable which I liked. The Pacer will be right in between both worlds, 415mm chainstays.
|185's in a crit?ps||atpjunkie|
Jan 24, 2003 9:52 AM
|good luck. sounds like you've got an excellent grip on the situation.
push the big gear!
|Roly Polies should be found....||unclefuzzy_ss|
Jan 25, 2003 2:45 PM
|in the QBP catalog Cloxxi--They also carry panaracer, so the extension of carrying teh Rivvies is natural. I'm also looking at a Pacer(what am I NOT looking at?). Prolly use mine for simple general riding though. Anyways, since Q carries the tire, it should be pretty easy for you to get.
|Roly Polies should be found....||Jan Gerrit Klok|
Jan 28, 2003 2:11 AM
|Thanks, yes I did find them to be carrying them as well. Though, I'll probably try to get them through a local distributor that may have them, as getting them over the ocean makes them kinda pricey.
27mm real seems to be a little narrow, at least in my mind, wonder what exactly it is that makes them so much better than other 28mm offerings. Then again, reports are clear, there's something special to those tires, and should be a long way in the direction I'm looking for. 27mm, that's over half between the 23c tires I find so scary and the 30mm Tufo T30 knobbies I trust so much, even on pavement.
I'll probably have to get me 3 of those.
Hey, they even might work with Stan's latex system in stead of with tubes, to offer even more grip and lower rolling resistance, but they'd have to be a real tight fit around the rim.
Last question, what pressures do people ride the Rolly's in relation to 23c ones? I'm most comfortable around 8 bars on 23c's.