|Does anybody know where pictures from the Boulder race||triple shot espresso|
Nov 11, 2002 6:54 AM
|can be found? That was a fun course.|
|Cat 3, Juniors, and Masters 35+ only||BipedZed|
Nov 11, 2002 7:02 AM
Personally I didn't like the course much. I thought it lacked a good speed barrier section and had some goofy obstacles like that 3ft drop off and the ditches (both concrete and dirt).
Nov 11, 2002 8:36 AM
|That course had so much potential. Especially the woods area. Instead of this commando jump, we could have gone up or down the stairs by the bridge. There were a bunch of logs on the side of the dirt trail that could have been used as natural obstacles. That ditch did not make sense to me. Other than an ankle busting trap. Go figure. I also wish there were no course changes once races have started or 5 minutes before a start. Once the course is set, don't touch it!|
|Boulder 3||p lo|
Nov 11, 2002 8:53 AM
|i agree that the course has a bunch potential. It was just a little to straight (not enough twisty technical sections). that 3 foot drop was pretty wild and good for the spectators but not really that fun for the racers.
trends for the co season???? - no high speed barrier sections and a sudden facination with sand......
Nov 11, 2002 9:03 AM
|That drop off wasn't that bad, but I have a bad left ankle with no ligaments due to a XC running injury so I made sure I landed on both feet each lap. I did a lap before they changed the course and liked it much better.
Schwab is the only series with consistant speed barriers. I like speed barriers because they are a cyclocross-specific skill. Whether you can hop them or are just really smooth and fast over a set of speed barriers, being able to negotiate them well separates the cross specialists from the mountain bikers and the roadies.
And I agree, the sand thing is more and more prevalent, not necessarily a bad thing, but compensate with some speed stuff. Of course, who am I to complain as I haven't helped with any course setup.
|Course trends -- side note||wahleyed|
Nov 11, 2002 9:21 AM
|We asked the Kona pros how they liked the course on Sat. and they loved it. The only downside, they said, were the flats caused by rolling over the metal edging which lines the walking path you cross before heading down the hill to the barriers, bridge and previously mentioned "commando jump". (I think the jump got me in the lower back -- really sore all day yesterday. gettin' old I guess).
Personally, I liked both course this weekend. Not that my results showed it, but I think the Red Rocks course was greatly improved from the 1st go-round.
|Course trends||p lo|
Nov 11, 2002 9:25 AM
|True, I am not really complaining about the courses either(although I like a high speed barrier section too). I am actually really glad that we have some promoters stepping up and giving us different courses. i think we have 6 or 7 venues this year and compared to last year when we did 6 races at research park. Things are back to looking up for the CO cross scene.
So the real thing we need to do is support Red Rocks, Schwab, and BoulderRacing for making this season a true step up from last year.
I think GMSV is going to try to put on at least one race next season too. What about VC, you have enough guys doing cross to put one on as well?
Nov 11, 2002 10:54 AM
|I am but a pawn but I'd like to suggest to the higher ups that we do a cross race (or series) for next season. A couple of us briefly tried to get one going for this season but there wasn't much interest.
Brian H is a VC racer...does that count? ;-)
|New races||p lo|
Nov 11, 2002 1:46 PM
|yeah he is!!!!! So your covered, but if you can help get Colorado another race for next year it would benefit everyone......
maybe there should be a cyclo-cross sub-committe within the ACA. We are going to have to restructure the season next year if nationals are going to january????
|Boulder 3 - u do better||IGPilot|
Nov 12, 2002 11:42 AM
|Hey boys - regarding the course changes, there are a lot of behind the scenes politics going on, plus we like to accommdate juniors with an easier course and make 'em harder for you big boys. If you can't take the heat in the kitchen... * High speed barriers, yea I love the C Springs course, 25mph into a triple set of barriers, ACL reconstructive surgery anyone. The problem with the high speed barriers is the fast guys can easily bunnyhop the barriers, so thats why we've been going towards technical sections involving barriers. Personally, I think it sucks when the bunnyhoppers can get a 10 sec advantage on each set of barriers. * Wooded section, more potential - I didn't see you out there at 6am on Thurs before work cutting a path through the woods. P Lo has the right attitude - help set up, help design the course. Seriously, everyone greatly appreciates the races and we try our best, it wasn't that bad at all for a first year venue.|
|Boulder 3 - u do better||yodester|
Nov 12, 2002 1:21 PM
|You're implying that a high speed barrier section is more dangerous than having a 3 ft. drop? Coming into the barriers you have the choice as to what speed you want to dismount from, with the 3 ft. drop there was no choice -- jump down and hope you don't twist your ankle. Also, properly spaced barriers can negate a bunny-hoppers advantage while still allowing the riders with good technique to open gaps on riders with limited 'cross skills. Trust me, I appreciate yours and everyone else's time and effort putting on the races. Thank you!|
|Boulder 3 - u can always improve!||eurochien|
Nov 12, 2002 1:53 PM
|I understand that when you promote a 'cross event, especially a series, you kind of take any criticism personally. I've been there before. I promoted cyclo-cross races (Franktown, CO) in 99 and 2000 so I think I know what I'm talking about. The fact that I wasn't there at 6 am setting up should not prevent me from having an opinion now, should it? Besides I couldn't be there 'cos I had to help my own team set up for the next day's race in Morrison... I understand the hard work that goes into an event and I enjoyed 99% of the Xylinx venue (the 1% is that damn drop-off). To try and explain to you where these ideas are coming from, personally, I have this image of World Championships courses from all those euro videos where you rarely see run-downs, drop-offs, singletrack (argh!) and that kind of stuff. Generally those UCI type courses are fast and "flowing" (of course it helps pertetuate this impression when the guys racing are world-class). Anyway don't take these opinions the wrong way, everyone's psyched to race varied, quality events. You all are on the right track. Franck|
|Boulder 3 - u can always improve!||p lo|
Nov 12, 2002 7:21 PM
|i agree that every course could be improved. but to be truthful most of the improvements i would make are just to make the course suite me.
ummmm, i am slow here, the course would be much better if they change that.....
and i also always think the sections i am fast on are great sections...........
|racing vs. promoting - a bit long.||eurochien|
Nov 12, 2002 8:06 PM
|I agree with you to a point. You have several factors to consider when promoting: the venue that you have at your disposal, how long you need to make the laps either in terms of time or length and making it fun and challenging for the majority of racers. What you'll come up with as a promoter on "your" course will not necessarily suit you as a racer, but you know that a lot of participants may like it (could be a long uphill, a twisty downhill, concrete stairs, whatever). One constant is safety. You don't want someone bashing their skull or busting their knees or something because of some course design, you want everyone to go home with a tired, happy grin on their face and not expose yourself to personal injury lawsuits (when it comes right down to it I think the release doesn't weigh much). Plus when you promote a race, more often than not you're too tired or stressed out to race well so it really doesn't matter how well the course suits your own abilities (I remember racing my own event and stopping to fix some broken tape), you'll probably race like crap.|
|racing vs. promoting - a bit long.||p lo|
Nov 13, 2002 5:29 AM
|promoting sounds like it probably is a pretty thanksless job. there is always someone who goes home unhappy for one reason or another. i think at least in cross i hear alot of people thanking the promoter at the races. on boulderracing.com yesterday there were a bunch of posts praising the course from last weekend.
either way we (GMSV) are planning on promoting a cross race next year. now all we have to do is find a location......
btw, i remember having alot of fun at franktown back when you put on those races. fun courses.
|Boulder 3 - u do better||wahleyed|
Nov 12, 2002 3:25 PM
|Ok, so my back hurt some Sunday and Monday (not sure if it was the raking Sat or jumping into the pit or both), but I think the ditch was fun. Actually, the changes made from the early course to the later course were good. I liked the medium speed, off camber & wrong sided (for us right handed riders) dismount then on to the ditch.
I think its good that each course has it's own signature. That course could have easily been a research park part II (which I also like mind you), but it had some twists that were good. Though I was horrible at jumping the little drainage ditch -- I enjoyed that I had options to consider in that section every lap.
Hey franck -- take another look at your videos -- those courses might be pretty wide, but there's usually just one good line and it kinda looks like a single track...
I was challenged Sat (and Sunday!) and enjoyed the races a great deal.