|Ultegra v. Chorus||werdna|
Dec 9, 2003 11:21 AM
|I'm building a Serotta Colorado III to use as my training bike (Yes, I am spoiled. I work at a shop.) I would like to keep the cost down as much as possible, but I want really reliable stuff. I do have a PowerTap so I was inclined to get Ultegra, but looking at the prices, Chorus is very tempting. How well do the Shimano spline->Campy shifting cassettes work? Are they durable or expensive? Any thoughts on bar, stem, seatpost?
|Chorus it is...||C-40|
Dec 9, 2003 11:56 AM
|Many folks have reported good results with the Accelerator cassette, available from Excel Sports for $130. It is simply a modified Ultegra cassette, so the durability is equal to Ultegra.
2003 chorus is on sale at many online dealers, but perhaps your shop price is even better. Nothing wrong with Centaur either, but a swap to a Chorus crank and bottom bracket would be a cheap and valuable upgrade to a Centaur group. Campy is the way to go, IMO. Otherwise you get a soon-to-be-obsolete 9-speed group.
|Will D/A and Ultegra 9sp ever be obsolete?||BIG RING|
Dec 9, 2003 1:55 PM
|With the thousands of cyclists using these gruppos, do you think Shimano will just write everyone off and say, "use 10sp or your out."
I've had Record 10 sp twice and gotten rid of it twice. No problems, and looked great. Some people call Campy shifting "sure" or "resolute." Others call it "mechanical" or "clunky." I am in the latter group. Nothing better than being able to smoothly down shift with literally your right pinky without having to shift your grip on the hoods IMO.
|Will D/A and Ultegra 9sp ever be obsolete?||Ironbutt|
Dec 9, 2003 2:28 PM
|I seriously doubt that D/A and/or Ultegra nine speed will be obsolete in the forseeable future. It may not be the "latest and greatest" from either a technological or marketing standpoint, but from a functionality standpoint it will be around for a long time because it quite simply works. Parts for Shimano eight speed are readily available, and it's been a while since it was discontinued in favor of nine speeds. And if Shimano componentry was nearly as fragile and unreliable as some would have us think, it would have disappeared from the marketplace as quickly as Campy Record Off-Road. Yes, I got suckered into that one some years ago, and it fell apart in about a half dozen rides. Oh, well, live and learn.|
|How is Chorus....||6was9|
Dec 9, 2003 1:58 PM
|BB/Crank better than Centaur? It'll cost me about $60 more for them. Just curious.
Also would Chorus deraileur be better than Centaur for about $30 more?
BTW who's having 03 Chorus on sale?
|How is Chorus....||turbo6bar|
Dec 9, 2003 3:07 PM
|From what I've read, the Chorus/Record bottom bracket is lighter and supposedly better. To use the Chorus BB, you must also use a Chorus or Record crankset.
Dunno about the derailleurs. The weakness of Centaur/Veloce, for lack of a better term, is the bottom bracket and hubset. I went with Veloce 04 for the price savings, and applied the money towards better hubs and crankset. The overall performance is near Record/Chorus at a slight weight penalty (not enough for me to worry).
Dec 9, 2003 3:33 PM
|The Centaur bototm bracket is a cheap item that requires different tools to install than Chorus/Record BB (which uses the cassette lockring tool for very simple installation). It also has a 111mm spindle length, compared to the 102mm for Chorus and Record, which means that that you can't upgrade to a Chorus or Record BB without a Chorus or Record crank.
There may not be anyone with an entire groupo sale, but I would try www.wisecyclebuys.com. I just bought a 2003 Chorus rear derailleur and Record front derailleur from them for $150. The leftovers go pretty fast, so maybe it's already too late. Total Cycling has the Chorus crank priced at $93.
Dec 9, 2003 4:29 PM
|I ordered GVH Chorus/Centaur complete build kit(all Chorus except brakes and cassette) including Proton wheels, Prolink saddle, cheaper ITM bars, stem, seat post etc for $1097 including shipping. If you subtract the wheelset and other stuff that comes with this kit it comes out pretty cheap; I haven't seen anything lower than around $800 for chorus group(excluding hubs and headset.)
BTW Total price for Chorus crank is 90 UK Pound which is about $155. Excel's price($109.80 for crank & $44 for BB)is so far the best. I'll have to check out Wise.
Dec 9, 2003 10:35 PM
|Total do have $98 Chorus crank but only in 175mm; not my size thus it wasn't on my list.|
|re: Ultegra v. Chorus||Steve Bailey|
Dec 9, 2003 5:28 PM
|My Lemond Ti is Ultegra 9 spd. double, my Heron steel is Chorus Ergo and R derailer with all else Ultegra, except the crank, which is a 110/74.
The Ergo front shifter is a superior shifter. Lots of trim positions, which is important on a triple and which sucks on anything Shimano - double or triple. I'm now considering switching the Lemond to Ergo.
I've used the Wheels Manufacturing Campy spaced/Shimano hub cassettes - they work very well, are very expensive ($100) but are as durable as anything else from Shimano - it's basically a re-built Shimano cassette spaced to Campy. A solution that works just as well is to put a Shimano 8 spd. cassette spacer in the middle of the 9 spd. cassette - the 15/16 location on a 12-21 works for me. It takes up the difference in the cable pull of the Ergo system (1.5mm over the cassette range).
Going Ergo will also free you from the Shimano crank/b-bracket tyranny. Maybe go to a Ritchey or FSA double 110 BCD crank ?, that seems to be all the rage these days and you don't need special ramped/pinned rings with Ergo.
The Ergo levers work fine with any Shimano brake as well.
|How about Ultegra AND Veloce!||the bull|
Dec 9, 2003 6:01 PM
|I like the Campy hoods.
I like cheap well shifting HG cassetes and chains of Shimano.
On my every day bike I am using older Dura-ace hubs, with a 9 speed HG cassette and chain.
I have Veloce 9 speed shifters and derailleur.
This would let you use your power tap wheelset as is.
Veloce is cheap and reliable.
So the real question is: Which shifting/hood style do you like?
|American Classic||Mel Erickson|
Dec 10, 2003 12:58 PM
|I'm putting one on a bike I'm building. Can't say much about durability or shifting since I haven't used it yet. I wouldn't think durability would be an issue (steel). Reports are shifting is just fine. Cost = $65, can't beat that!|
|re: Ultegra v. Chorus||tarwheel|
Dec 11, 2003 7:38 AM
|I've got Chorus on one bike, and Ultegra on another. Both function great. Finish is nicer on Chorus, but Ultegra isn't shabby. The biggest difference (other than 9 vs. 10 speeds) is maintenance costs. Campy cassettes and chains are ridiculously expensive and prices have been going up. For a training bike, I would choose Ultegra for that reason alone, but your financial situation might be different than mine. Compatibility is also an issue. If your already running Shimano gear on other bikes, I would stick with Ultegra. Might as well have interchangeable parts if you have several bikes.|
|re: Ultegra v. Chorus||werdna|
Dec 11, 2003 8:05 AM
|I would definitely use 1 manufacturer with all my bikes. I'm leaning towards Campy now.
Thanks for the advice.
Dec 11, 2003 10:18 PM
|I have Ultegra on my old '98 Klein QR that has about 30K on it and Chorus/Record mix on my "new" Colnago MXL (18 months old now) with over 10K on it. I bounce back and forth between both bikes, but spend most of my time on the Colnago. I have the full Chorus group excluding the Record ergo levers and rear derailleur. I like the way the Campy group functions, the shifting is more precise, however this is comparing it to the Ultegra group that has been well used. I prefer the shape of the Ultegra brake hoods, I had to mess with the position of the ergo levers about a zillion time to get them to feel comfortable and when I get back on my Ultegra bike that is the first thing I notice. Another good point is the price for maintenance. The Campy stuff is, like tarwheel said, are ridiculously expensive. Knock on wood I still have my original Chorus cassette, but I did not realize they were so expensive until I noted the price in a catalog. Even things like Campy chains ( or alternatives) can be expensive. I use a Dura Ace chain on the Ultegra bike and it cost me $39.00. But all being said, if I were to buy another bike again, I'd probably go with Campy as I just like the way it functions and looks. But if I had a second bike or was strapped for money, Ultegra is a very good group for the price. Maintenance is where you spend the money.
I have to force myself to get on my old Klein once and awhile and I think "oh cra* I have to ride the junky Ultegra bike today" and each time I ride it I'm reminded that this is a very nice group. Ultegra is a good group, you can't go wrong. It's the never ending debate about Campy vs Shimano...whatever works....
|$39 for a DA chain???....||TFerguson|
Dec 13, 2003 3:10 PM
|You mean Campy chain. I just got a brand new 7700 of eBay for $17.02, shipped. This summer, I purchased 3 combos of Ultegra chain/cassette for $40 per combo from Performance. I've run Campy and it is expensive, especially if you have MTB bikes. The parts cost more, deals barely exist and you need the Shimano tools anyway.
|AC site says their conversion cassettes no go with PowerTap...||satanas|
Dec 14, 2003 9:39 AM
|...so you may be better advised to stick with Shimano if you want to use the PowerTap hub.|| |