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Ksyrium pop & ping(14 posts)

Ksyrium pop & pingB2
Aug 4, 2003 2:20 PM
My Ksyrium rear wheel makes a popping, pinging kind of noise. I've found that if I lube the spokes at the hub that the noise goes away.

The first time I did this I was able to ride ~800 miles before it reoccurred. The next time I was able to get maybe 600 miles and the next time maybe 500 miles.... you get the idea. I'm now at the point where I need lube every 150 miles or so. I'm using an aerosol silicone spray that's mostly solvent to flush out the old lube each time and then applying Boeshield T-9.

Has anyone else encountered this problem? Any recommendations on how to resolve this once and for all?

Thanks,
Bryan
re: Ksyrium pop & pingnewridr
Aug 4, 2003 2:45 PM
I'm no expert, but have you checked the spoke tension? It sounds like there is metal rubbing on metal if lube will temporarily relieve the noise. Could be that there are some tensions that aren't equal.

Just my $0.02
I have the same problem!the bull
Aug 4, 2003 3:44 PM
I put tri flow and the sound has returned.
Next I am going to use some moly-coat I think.
I ride with a stereo so it does not bother me to much.
I have found that when you have a campy bike you have to do something to override all the noise!
Get a Prof Wheel Builder opinionWiseGuy
Aug 5, 2003 5:42 AM
I know several riders that have experiened "popping & pinging" with their wheels (I'm not sure if any were Ksyriums). After digging into the root cause of these noises, they found one or both of the following problems existed:
1) Improper / inconsistent spoke tensioning
2) Inadequate or no stress relieving after truing

In all cases, the problems were solved by proper tensioning and stress relieving. My suggestion is to have a professional wheel builder evaluate your wheels.
"wheelbuilder" and "Kserium"- illegal to use in same sentence?off roadie
Aug 5, 2003 6:22 AM
I'm not sure pro wheelbuilders can (or would want to) deal with Kseriums, or if Mavic allows such adjustment without voiding the warrenty. The typically recomended solution for most Kserium problems is to return them to Mavic for service or replacement. At a GUESS, I'd say you may have insufficient tension, which maybe a shop or builder expereinced with Mavic wheels could fix- but that should also be a warrenty issue, as Mavic should not ship Kseriums that aren't good to go "off the rack".

The Kserium is a factory built wheel with a spoke design unlike anything a wheelbuilder would normally deal with. Hell, the spokes are ALUMINUM, and have no bends at the elbows. The design is meant to make stress releif a non-issue, and I'm pretty sure it is metalurgicly impossible to "stress releive" aluminum via normal methods anyhow.

While some (adveretising dependant) magazines laud the benefits of "off the rack race wheels", conventional wheels have many benefits. Even the Kseriums don't have much advantage in weight or aerodymics over certain "conventional" wheels. With normal wheels, Its not at all hard to learn to do all the things a pro wheelbuilder would do, and it can be fairly cheep to buy the tools needed. Once you learn the skills, you can get many thousands of trouble free miles from any decent conventionaly built wheelset, and even some of the "exotics" which use more conventional materials.
What to dobignslow
Aug 5, 2003 6:07 AM
Get your wheel checked out by your LBS, just to be safe. There is no sense in wrecking a $450 wheel trying to be a cheap-o. Then buy some Dri-Slide lube. Put it on the spoke heads. I had this problem with mine, and this is what I did and have had zero problems since.
Tension and Pro Wheel BuildersB2
Aug 5, 2003 6:44 AM
Yeah the Ksyriums are bit of a different critter. Heck I could bring the tension up or down if only I knew what it should be and how to check it. I know a good mechanic at one of the LBS's that's usually pretty good at this kind of thing and is very familiar with Ksyriums. I remember him telling me that (for some reason I don't remember) he built up Ksyrium wheelset himself a year or two ago. I guess I'll see what he thinks about it.

I'm not familiar with Dri-Slide lube. What is it? Where do you get it?

Thanks for replys,
Bryan
Tension and Pro Wheel Buildersbignslow
Aug 5, 2003 10:34 AM
Dri Slide was a tiny company in Fremont, MI before it was purchased by Guardsman out of Grand Rapids, MI. If my memory is correct, Dri-Slide was the first folks to master a graphite liquid lube that dried and did not attract gobs of dirt and grime. Here is a link I found to get it. http://www.bikeusa.com/MERCHANT2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=MSGI&Category_Code=Lubricants

I get mine from my LBS in Jax, Fl. So I don't know anything about that website, other than the price is comparable.
Your spoke tensions are whacked!buffedupboy
Aug 5, 2003 9:47 PM
Okay, I am no expert but I will give it my best shot. Chances are your spokes are imbalanced. Chances are also that it is rubbing where the spokes are crossing, nothing to do with the joint. The reason why it is rubbing is because some spokes have become loose and hence the blades are not straight thus causing them to rub when the wheel enevitably pulls more on one side. Chances are also that the pinging sounds are coming from the non-drive side.......

You can hold two spokes between your fingers and pull them together, you will be able to notice whether any of them have become loose. But like everyone else's advice, bring it to a good wheel builder or your local Mavic distributor if they are still under warranty.

Sean
Non-Drive Side...... BingoB2
Aug 6, 2003 7:16 AM
Yep I only have to lube the non-drive side for it to go away. I have checked the spokes (simply by squeezing drive and non-drive spokes together - hard to do it any other way with bladed spokes) and all of them feel tensioned MUCH more than a conventional wheel (as they should). Seems odd that lubing the spoke to hub connection would cause the noise to go away if the noise is related to spokes rubbing where they cross?

At any rate I threw the bike in the van a few moments ago and I'll swing by the LBS at lunch today and see what they think may be the problem.

Thanks for the input,
Bryan
Non-Drive Side...... BingoSirius
Aug 6, 2003 7:57 PM
The spokes on the Ksyriums do not touch each other where they cross.
re: Ksyrium pop & pingpa rider
Aug 7, 2003 10:10 AM
Sorry for late post B2. But you didn't say what you weight. My friend "Big John" broke 1 spoke and had 4 loose ones 2 weeks ago. The local lbs called mavic and got this information.

If your over 200 or more pounds you shouldn't have their wheels. Maybe if your a light rider you can get away with ksyriums. My friend broke a rim last year as well as 2 other guys over 200+ locally.

I guess they don't want to warrenty the rims or spokes anymore. My friend John had a spoke pull out of the rim. He's about 230 lbs.

Maybe this info doesn't apply, but I thought I pass it on to you.

Emory
At 175 I'm not exactly a light weight, butB2
Aug 7, 2003 11:30 AM
I certainly wouldn't consider myself a Clyde either.

Thanks for the info Emory.

FWIW - LBS says Mavic doesn't have specific tension recommendations for the spokes. Apparently they recommend a specific number of threads showing and/or a specific number of turns when installing. They claim the tolerances are tight enough that if you thread the nipple onto the spoke a specific number of revolutions that the tension will be consistent and correct.

This particular bike mechanic has never failed me yet and he's recommending that I try blue locktite at the spoke/hub connection. Sounds like a lousy solution, but I might just give it try.

Bryan
Your LBS is smoking crack....divve
Aug 10, 2003 11:02 AM
The spoke tension for the front is specified by Mavic between 100-120kgf and for the rear drive side 130-150kgf (the non-drive side will automatically take care of its own tension when correctly dished)