|Cane Creek Wheels - Special||TheKid|
Sep 11, 2002 11:45 AM
|Has anybody looked into the upgrade promotion by Crane Creek that is popping up on this website. $200 off MSRP of certain wheelsets for a trade-in of any other wheelset. Aerohead SS set would be $350 plus shipping. How would this set compare to others at this price?|
Sep 11, 2002 12:06 PM
|A deal on something that you don't want isn't much of a deal. More than being some lame attempt at a back handed insult I seriously question all these "fabulous new and improved" products that are suddenly replaced with yet another "fabulously new and improved" product. If the dang thing was so good why is it being replaced? Also, isn't there a credibilty issue here? There will always be specials on some high zoot product that didn't pan out so well or live up to the hype - the entire Spinergy product line is a great example (to pick on someone else). Sure people love them, but many more have had problems. A truely great product doesn't need to be redesigned every year or six months - great designs (and manufacturing) stand the test of time. Not that time ever stands still - there are innnovations in materials, designs, manufacturing, and all forms of engineering that make the unthinkable possible. I guess it's all a philosophical way of saying buyer beware. They want your money and the product isn't selling so well. There's a message in there if you read between the lines.|
|no need caveat emptor.||weiwentg|
Sep 11, 2002 12:50 PM
|> ...I seriously question all these "fabulous new and improved" products that are suddenly replaced with yet another "fabulously new and improved" product. If the dang thing was so good why is it being replaced
correct me if I'm wrong, but you do own a pair of Ksyriums ...
seriously, I have two Cane Creek wheelsets (one Aerohead, one WAM Disc). both are good. the spec weights aren't amazing, but they simply feel light. and they are pretty strong.
the reviews on MTBR are very positive. some on RBR have indicated some problems with the hubs. Cane Creek's customer service is great (by reports). I have dealt with them, to get my rear wheel rebuilt after a crash. service was prompt.
grzy is correct in that they are not selling well, at least not for the road wheelsets. admittedly, at MSRP, prices are steep. I did pay $350 for my set of aeroheads on ebay. no one bid.
the wheels feature what I believe are sensible innovations. straight pull spokes are reportedly stronger (according to Zipp as well as Cane Creek), and the nipples at the hubs is smart (it also places the alloy nipples away from the gunk on the roads).
so, in the end, grzy may not want them much, but $350 for a new set of Aeroheads is a good deal. I've seen them sell for less on ebay, however.
Sep 11, 2002 1:00 PM
|Cane Creeks are one of the few built wheelsets Mike Garcia (www.oddsandendos.com) approves of. I spoke with him by email.|
|Ohhh, I See||grzy|
Sep 11, 2002 1:58 PM
|They must be fabulous! |
You've ridden the wheels and think they're the greatest thing since sliced bread and may even have stock in the company. Who knows. All I'm saying is be carefull of some to good to be true offer on the web for some fringe product that isn't that well accepted. It will always have it's fans, but just enough to be on the fringe which is where some people want to be.
Hey, Cane Creek is simply Dia Comp stuff with a botique label. None of their stuff has been that good, not their brakes, not their headsets, not their MTB shocks, etc. People have reported frequent problems with the wheel sets. These days everyone and their brother has some high-zoot wheel set and a lot of them just don't live up to the hype. If they work for you that's great, but what's with the deal of offering a trade in on a new set of wheels? What does that say about the existing wheels? What I'm riding has nothing to do with the issue - nor did I bring it up or even advise it. What does Mike say about Mavic? Does it even matter since he's not riding, buying, repairing or servicing the wheels?
Putting the nipples in at the hub is nothing new - Shimano and Spinergy also do it. To be innovative you have to be first, by definition. The drawback of course is that you need to pull the cassette to true the rear wheel. So what you have is a wheel that's not that light, which isn't that innovative, coming from a company that has a long sorrid history of not really building high end stuff, that's pretty expensive, and not selling, but you can have the latest feature creep version now for a bargain. Just doesn't sound like a great deal to me. But hey, it's just my opinion and who knows - I could be totally wrong.
And then you point out that you can get them for less elsewhere. So, correct me if I'm wrong, but if you were to answer the original question you'd have to tell the poster that the wheels are OK, but the price isn't that good, but you're pretty defensive about them due to some latent insecurity....or is this too personal?
|I see you're still as feisty as ever.||weiwentg|
Sep 11, 2002 4:21 PM
|but please, keep it civillized; you seem to have some difficulty doing so.
personally, I think they're very good wheels, and that it's quite odd that they're a fringe product. this may be due to the rather high MSRP; $350 is probably a much better price for MSRP. as for Mike, he has a thing about Ksyriums (I do not, personally).
I think my latent insecurities and defensiveness are all in your head. let's make my views clear: the MSRP is not good; with the trade in plan, the price is right; furthermore, you seem to be in one of those insulting moods again. been drinking lately?
what you're riding only has to do with your rant about fabulously new and improved products - exactly what the Ksyriums are hyped to be. I demoed a friend's pair. they are good wheels. my opinion is that they are not worth MSRP either. if I could get them at a good price (and didn't have a pair of Cane Creeks), I probably would, same as my Cane Creeks. and it would seem that you did the same, unless you did pay MSRP. so, you're basically doing exactly what I did.
you'll probably say I'm being insecure and all that. well, if you cannot answer in a reasonable and civil fashion, I have decided that I am in a sufficiently bad mood that I will reply in kind. you know, usually you're helpful and informative, if a bit in your face. usually that last bit is not a problem except for recently when you insulted someone over some bearings.
Sep 11, 2002 7:53 PM
|Who pays MSRP for anything? |
I just don't get the Cane Creek experience. We seem to be saying roughly the same thing although approaching it from different ends (me negative - you positive): questionable wheels (design, weight, quality) at a so-so deal (which you can do better elsewhere). So why should the guy go for the deal that he saw other than being on the fringe?
Sorry to offend you - I actually haven't been drinking much at all (maybe that's my problem). There is one fact - if they're so great why are they a fringe product? It can't be that we're all morons missing out on a fabulous opportunity. I guess I see this trend in the wheel segement of the bike biz to have the "hot new design of the month" that's going to make you loads faster only to find out that there's some serious design/manufacturing flaws and the end user becomes an unwitting beta tester on the bleeding edge and the design changes and we'll sell you an upgrade. Kind of a Microsoft trick when you think about it. Witness Rolf, Spinergy, or any one of a slew of trendy wheel designs. Ksyriums on the other hand have a proven track record from a company that has been producing high end wheel goods for quite some time. You can't argue too much with success, but you can find a lot of fault with stuff that just gets tossed out there. I'm not sure there's enough data on the latest Cane Creek wheel desing to make an informed and objective decision on the product - maybe there is. However, I can objectively tell you what I think of their other stuff based on personal experience and reviews. Maybe they've broken the pattern and hired a whole new slew of engineers.
I guess I "insulted" the guy over bearings b/c he was so obviously wrong yet he stated things as if it were a fact. If you're going to state the "facts" then at least have them right - it confuses the hell out of the rest of the people who aren't sure and are looking for the correct answer. Maybe I need to put the kid gloves on when I type? Hey, the sun rises in the west! Now, don't you dare call me an idiot. ;-)
Sep 11, 2002 8:33 PM
|> Who pays MSRP for anything?
all right, so we do have something in common... :)
> There is one fact - if they're so great why are they a fringe product? It can't be that we're all morons missing out on a fabulous opportunity...
now, this I do not pretend to know; my only speculation is the MSRP. Cane Creek wheels aren't hugely different from the mythical 'standard wheel'. perhaps you have a point about the company's reputation ... they certainly don't match Mavic in this regard. and yes, I have heard some not too positive things about their other stuff, although I have not tried it myself. what I can say is that mountain bikers seem to appreciate their wheels more than road bikers. off-roadies seem not to have had many issues for some reason.
and for what it's worth, I agree with you about Ksyriums. in my case, I got the Cane Creeks because a) my MTB friend has a set of WAMs, and vouched for them, b) they were cheaper, and c) I guesstimated that the rims were lighter. having ridden both wheels now, I THINK I am correct on the rims.
> Maybe I need to put the kid gloves on when I type?
no, just don't be TOO rough. that answer was a perfectly reasonable, well argued one. and I'm sorry to imply that you might be alcoholic.
Sep 12, 2002 6:39 AM
|My "thing" about the Krysiums is directly related to how much they cost. I'll admit that I'm skeptical about the real advantage to using a reduced number of $5 aluminum spokes, but most folks that own them are pleased with the way they perform. Happy customers seem to be the best indicator of product performance. It's just that their high MSRP means that they are very rarely the best available choice for the money, in my opinion. It's possible to do a lighter, more aerodynamic set for a fraction of the very high MSRP Mavic USA tries to enforce on those wheels.
My other whiny commentary has been directed toward the the "optimistic" advertised weights I've seen for these wheels. To me, if you are charging $800 for a wheelset, having a 5% weight variation from spec is pretty extreme. It's considered "normal variation" for these to come in 40g or more over the advertised weight, which seems kinda casual considering how much they cost. Some variation is natural and unavoidable, but anything over 3% seems high for a wheelset in that price range. I average about 1.5% over or under ad weight for my wheels. If I can keep every single one of my $300 wheelsets within 3% of advertised spec (and guarantee it!), they should be able to the same with their $800 wheelset, don't you think? Especially since they are making their own rims?
(Odds and Endos)
|Missing the Boat?||TrekFurthur|
Sep 12, 2002 7:54 AM
|Interesting discussion Grzy and weweiwng (hope I spelled all that correct). However, it seems you both are assuming that one must trade Cane Creek a set of Cane Creek wheels one already owns . . . check out the website or call them, because that's not the case. Trade in ANY wheelset you own to get this deal; pretty standard promotional ploy in most industries ("so, you like their stuff? Try ours.") No, I don't own any Cane Creek wheels, nor do I work for the company. If I had the dough, I might take them up on the promotion as the Carbons look like good wheels (and I've heard good things about them).|
|read the fine print...carbons are NOT included in the deal! NM||IAmtnbikr|
Sep 12, 2002 8:43 AM
Sep 12, 2002 10:27 AM
|I did see (on the website) that you could trade in any set of wheels, presumably including a pair off a Huffy.
the downside is that you have to pay shipping both ways (I think).
as for the Carbons, they're way overpriced at MSRP, even worse than the Aeroheads.
Sep 12, 2002 10:58 AM
|As for the Cronos not being included (which is what the rep. with whom I spoke said), I wonder what results one would see with a phone call placed as high up the ladder at Cane Creek as one can go to ask why the carbon models are not included when they are the ONLY ones in the banner ads.
There's your reason not to buy them--misleading advertising.
|why not spend $34 more a 1300 gram wheelset from||IAmtnbikr|
Sep 12, 2002 3:27 AM
|Mike at http://www.oddsandendos.com. Ordered mine and hope to have them midweek. Check out the website, or call him, he is a wealth of information. Then, you could have the light wheelset, and keep yours for spares, or sell them.|| |