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2 Cross/3 Cross Wheel Building Problem(9 posts)

2 Cross/3 Cross Wheel Building ProblemTFerguson
Jun 10, 2002 12:33 PM
I'm building my first multi-cross wheel set and have run into a snag. It's a rear, non-disc with 3-cross drive and 2-cross non. I have the different spoke lengths with the drive side 3-cross about 5mm longer than the non side. I just finished lacing the wheel and started tightening the spokes. The drive side pulling spokes and the non-drive side braking (if it were disc) are very tight and the other 16 are still very loose. I've checked all of the spoke lengths and the lacing. I am using the standard Brandt "The Bicycle Wheel" building method. Where am I going wrong?
re: 2 Cross/3 Cross Wheel Building Problemfeathers mcgraw
Jun 10, 2002 1:00 PM
This sounds insane, but are you alternating spoke holes from side to side? Are you running out of threads on the loose spokes?
Alternating – yes, insane – definitely, ….TFerguson
Jun 10, 2002 1:19 PM
I don't know if I would actually run out of threads, but they would be sticking out of the tops of the nipples with the tight ones still showing threads. I stopped before going further because something is wrong.
I think that you need to start over.the dad
Jun 10, 2002 1:48 PM
It sounds to me like you're off a hub hole in the side-to-side relationship.

Just for my own information, what made you decide to go cross two on the left and cross three on the right?
Any reason to build one side first?TFerguson
Jun 10, 2002 2:27 PM
Brandt mentions lacing one side completely then the other when doing multi-crossed wheels. Any reason other than maybe less confusing?

As to why: Partially for a lighter yet durable (always our goal) wheelset with 2-cross on the front and left rear, but mostly because I've never done it before.
Well, that's not the way I do it but.the dad
Jun 10, 2002 3:02 PM
What I would try at this point would be to remove all of the spokes from the nipples on the left side and loosen all of the spokes till you have about 5 threads showing on the right. Then, starting at the valve hole, I'd try to figure out which spokes should go where on the left side. Be sure to have two parallel spokes flanking the valve stem. Good luck. Mixing the number of crosses make this process a bit more confusing than an all 3 cross wheel would be.

The wheels that I build are symmetrical. I install the pulling spokes first on the inside of both hub flanges. Then I can drop the outer spokes through the hub. That way I don't have to completely pre-lace the hub and I don't have to curl and bend spokes to get them to go where I want them.

Given my choice, I build wheels with the maximum number of crosses because I think that the weight difference is negligable and the strength difference is real.
I would check all my measurements and calculationsDirk Lenart
Jun 11, 2002 10:18 AM
I would start by measuring myself the ERD of the rim you're using. There are many wheelbuilding sites on the Net telling you how to do it. What I do is using two spokes, put them in their nipples and screw the nipple just to the point where the spokethread appears in the slot of the nipple. I measure from this point (in the slot) and cut the spoke at 15 cm. Do this for the other spoke as well. Now, put the two cut spokes in opposing holes of the rim. Measure carefully the gap between the two spokes in the middle of your rim. Now make the following calculation: 15 cm + 15 cm + gap cm= correct ERD measured from the slot of the nipple. You can safely add 1 mm for each spoke when reading the outcome of spokecalc because the spoke may reach the top of the nipple.
After that I would go to the best spokelength calculator on the Net: (spokecalc.xls-follow link to Sheldon Brown's site who's hosting Rinard's site now).
Put in the correct figures for rim and hub, number of spokes, crossings. Et voilà.
Compare to your current spokelengths. I suspect strongly that you've made a calculation error.
I would check all my measurements and calculationsCharlie - Empire Cycle Craft
Jun 12, 2002 7:46 PM
Why don't you just go to the DT website or call a local shop that has a computer program or a better method of getting that info for you?
I LACED IT WRONG - Thanks to all. (nm)TFerguson
Jun 13, 2002 5:53 AM