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Titanium drop out/ rear wheel movement!(9 posts)

Titanium drop out/ rear wheel movement!texbaz
May 13, 2002 6:29 PM
I have a LS Ultimate. I have about 3500 miles on the frame and a Mavic cosmos wheel set I purchased last summer. Just recently I have noticed the front of the rear wheel will slip towards the left chain stay, at first it was just hard acceleration now it happens with very little torque. I inspected the skewer and found that the serations on both faces are almost gone flat, smooth, the left side axle spacer also is pretty smooth, Question is can I salvage this wheelset can I order new parts and rebuild what is worn or can I get a better set of skewers that might do a better job of biting into the Ti drop outs?
re: Titanium drop out/ rear wheel movement!Nessism
May 13, 2002 7:14 PM
You might also want to look at the serations on the ends of the axle nuts. They are very important also. I've seen people add serated washers on the ends of the axle although this seems like a patchwork repair to me.

May 13, 2002 9:32 PM
I've had an LS Ultimate since '94.

You don't say what kind of skewers you're using, but I'll assume you have the Mavics that came with your wheels. Replace them. The only skewers I found that work dependably for me are Campy Record, although I suspect DA would do just as well.

Any kind of trick skewer, and particularly any Ti skewer, just doesn't seem to generate enough pressure. They changed their dropouts some years ago to a (supposedly) softer Ti alloy to ameliorate the problem, but I'm not sure it worked.

But it's not the wheels, it just the skewer. I'm sure your front skewer is working fine, and no need to replace that. Just change the rear one to a Record or DuraAce, and your problem will go away.
Salsa Flip-OffsSpoke Wrench
May 14, 2002 5:44 AM
They also have a reputation for "grabbing hard." Cost a bit more than DA but way less than Record.
Mavic Skewersgrzy
May 14, 2002 1:21 PM
The current Mavic skewers used on the Ksyriums are pretty bomber. High leverage and very secure. Can't imagince a steel skewer being worn down by titainium dropouts. Avoid all the cheesey ti skewers - they're way to flexy and lead to wheel slip. Both the Ultegra and DA skewers are rock solid as well.
re: Titanium drop out/ rear wheel movement!texbaz
May 14, 2002 6:20 PM
I have thought about this dilemma all day finally spoke to the folks at
Litespeed, a supposedly tech type lady who said she has been working for
litespeed for 2 years and has never heard of this condition. She also
recommended that the rearend could be out of alignment, which I don't think
so but I will have it looked at. I have a New pair of CXP33's for another
bike I have never used. I installed them and noticed that the wheel has much
less free play or slop when sitting loose in the drop outs. I also stopped
by the LBS to see about getting an alignment checked the various other LS
bikes in the shop and found that the rear dropouts with different wheels had
almost 0 play when the skewer was opened yet my wheel sets both the CXP and
the Mavic have considerable fore and aft slop. Maybe I have lemon!!!!

Thanks to all who have taken the time to respond I will report back with the
fix. I hope.
Rear dropout spacingNessism
May 15, 2002 5:50 AM
Sounds like your frame has a little extra rear spacing - distance between the rear dropouts. The measurement should be something in the 130 - 132 mm range. A little wider should be no big deal although at some point, I would have the frame fixed - maybe 135 mm?

I seriously doubt that this is your problem however. The most likely cause is lack of serrations on the end of the wheel axle nuts and/or the skewer. Also, you will want a fair amount of clamp load on the skewer so make sure it is tight.

How about trying a wheel that uses old fashion steel serrated axle nuts and a strong skewer? If this one stays put, you will know that the frame is not at fault.

Good luck.

May 16, 2002 3:59 PM
The amount of force it takes to close up any extra wide dropouts is tiny compared to the clamping force of the skewer. You can flex that rear triangle with your bare hands, but you couldn't hold a wheel in place bare handed to save your life. Serated lock nuts and skewer faces, and a strong skewer shaft are what is needed. Roughening the dropout faces is another route.
Nope what?Nessism
May 17, 2002 5:59 AM
I doubt the extra spacing is the cause of the slipping wheel. Regardless of the slipping though, the frame should be fixed if the rear spacing it out of spec.