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Bar & Stem(13 posts)

Bar & StemMikeC
Aug 21, 2001 11:20 AM
I'm in the last stages of actually making my fantasy become real...I'm a couple of days away from ordering a Seven Odonata.
I'll be transferring my existing Record group, but I'll need to spec a new bar and stem (I think I'll go with Seven's own seatpost. It's expensive at $125, but at least it's within the ballpark). However, Seven's customized stem is $350 (!!!) which I just can't swallow, and they don't make a road bar.
Here's the story:
48 years old
150 lb
Spinner more than masher
Centuries more than sprints
Both stand and sit during climbs
4000 miles/year
Normal size hands
Would appreciate a little shock absorbtion up front
No more crits!
Don't want to replace a cracked bar every season, but don't want to carry a heavyweight bar on a 2.5 lb frame either
Campy group, so cables run under the tape
I think the Odonata is beautiful in an understated way, so I don't want to ugly it up
Bike comes with a Wound-Up carbon fork, with a carbon-over-aluminum steerer.
Recommendations would be greatly appreciated.
re: Bar & StemTrekMan
Aug 21, 2001 2:23 PM
Hi MikeC,

I use a Deda Magic bar and stem, imho I think they look good and are strong, also the bars have grooves for brake and gear cables. The stem is for a 1 1/8 inch steerer but comes with a shim to allow it to be used with a 1 inch steerer. Only problem is the fact that the bar and stem are oversized, looks good on my Trek 2300, but on you Seven Odonata it might not. Can't comment on this point as I've never seen one.

Enjoy your new bike!

Charlie
If I may, I wouldn't go with oversized on your sleek Seven.bill
Aug 21, 2001 2:27 PM
I guess you have to figure out how much the added stiffness is worth to you, but you seem to want a little forgiveness and, aesthetically, I just wouldn't (but I have heard that the Deda parts are good).
If I may, I wouldn't go with oversized on your sleek Seven.TrekMan
Aug 21, 2001 2:45 PM
You're 100% right there Bill, oversized bars and stems look very silly on slim tubed sleek frames.
From what I've felt/seen/heard, you're going to do greatbill
Aug 21, 2001 2:25 PM
with the Wound-Up (I've had one for several years; replaced a Look -- no comparison, the Wound-Up is a great fork), which will smooth out the road harshness (and it handles great). After that, you want stiffness from your stem, and maybe you can accept a certain amount of forgiveness in the bars, with your confidence in the integrity of the bar being the limiting factor. I've used a 3TTT 220 bar, and it's been great; I've heard similar good things about the Prima 199; although some complain of its flexiness, it ain't that flexy and maybe it'll absorb a little road shock. I also just put on a 3TTT Zepp (although I haven't ridden it yet), and I'm impressed by it. It's light, it seems to be very stiff, and it goes on real nice. Seems to hold the bar as firmly as anything else I've tried. I was going to switch out to an ITM Millenium stem when the shop gets one in my size, which is also very light, but now I'm thinking of staying with the Zepp. The other stem people seem to speak highly of (including the much-maligned Grzy Mnky, of whom, over the years, I must say I've grown fond -- hey, my brother pisses me off all the time, too, but, like Grzy Mnky, he can be useful) is the Ritchey WCS.
go for the seven stemgordonley
Aug 21, 2001 3:16 PM
the seven stem and spacers finish the ti look of the bike. it is expensive but all the carbon on your bike is going to look the same as it's all advanced composite make for seven so why not finish the simple elegance with all seven ti too. the stem comes in three stiffness levels so you can get it the way you want. the bar can be any two grooved model that feels good to you. try some out where your buying the seven.
Think Twicegrzy mnky
Aug 21, 2001 4:17 PM
My buddies Onodata had their seatpost and has their stem. His seat post clamping mechanism broke after something like a year. It can't be fixed, only replaced, which is OK if it's not during the middle of some long-ass ride. He's only around 160, but rides like the wind. His Seven stem is the flexiest thing I've ever felt on a road bike. No lie. I'm in even more awe of his descending skills with this knowledge. His carbon steer Wound-Up fork is fine, but another buddies cracked. These are not friends of friends, but some of my regular riding buds. We do lots of long heinous rides and they truly know how to suffer. I'm not saying that this will happen to you or that, bite my tounge, itzcrap, but you asked for data as well as opinions.

Based on what I've seen I wouldn't hang these three components on one of my rides. Personally I think you can much better performance and value for your money. Dropping over three bills on a stem is obscene and niave, but there are several other makers offering the same thing - they aren't even that light.
Think TwiceMikeC
Aug 21, 2001 5:01 PM
I was planning on the fork with the carbon-wrapped aluminum steerer. Do you know if your buddy's was the all-carbon steerer, or the aluminum-carbon combo? Any feelings about the Woundup fork with all-aluminum steerer?
You mentioned the seatpost clamping mechanism. Do you mean the saddle clamp, or the seattube clamp?
Finally, what stem/bar combinations are you partial to?
Thanks. I DO appreciate the info.
Think Twicegrzy mnky
Aug 22, 2001 8:40 AM
Dunno about the fork steerer construction, I believe it had metal in it. I'll try to get some verifcation. He has been waiting for quite a while for warranty and this is his primary ride for Ironman Canada in 10 days. To say he's a little pissed would be an understatement. Note: i've included the expereinces of two buds: one owns the Seven with the seatpost/stem problem and the other runs a Co-Motion. Both have Wound-Up forks.

As far as the seatpost problem it's the clamping mechanisim that secures the saddle. The frame is fine. I run a Thomson and the geometry works for me -others require more setback, but since your frame is custom this shouldn't be a problem. My feeling is that a truly correctly sized frame shouldn't require lots of post setback unless you have out of the normal range of body proportions or you want someething out of the "norm" for frame geometry. I'm not saying there's anything wrong, but it doesn't seem to be in the "norm"

I'm quite partial to the Reynolds Ouzo Pro and the Ritchey WCS stem. Rock solid components. They're reasonably priced, the weight is good and the quality is there. Considerable improvement (handling and road feel) was noticed when I upgraded from and older Time steel/carbon fork and a quill stem. Both Wound-Up and Reynolds have been "endorsed" by Serotta - FWIW. The Serotta F-1 gets high marks from riders and I'm not necessarily talking Serotta-ites, but it's heavy (check the new Ti/Carbon unit) and way pricey.
Questionraler
Aug 22, 2001 9:47 AM
You said "My feeling is that a truly correctly sized frame shouldn't require lots of post setback unless you have out of the normal range of body proportions or you want someething out of the "norm" for frame geometry."

Frames and seatposts have always traditionally been designed around a seatpost with setback. The non-laidback Thomson is the part that is not normal. Am I right?? This part seems geared more toward the Triathlon rider with no offset.
Questiongrzy mnky
Aug 22, 2001 5:20 PM
True, setback to some degree has been around for a long time and there are enough variables between body and frame geometry that I don't think there are many absolutes. The tri riders actually go for seat post with "set forward" if they're using a traditonal road frame or more likely go with tri specific geometry to get them forward.

I think I was "backing into" my opinion based on the concept that people that have a custom type of a fit don't need much if any setback, however lots of people need setback b/c they've had to make their body fit the frame. Ultimately it doesn't matter what your preference of style is and fashions change. One also must consider the dressing of the seat rails has something to do with how much setback is required. I guess I start to question things when a typical saddle and something along the lines of a Thomson won't work for somebody, but it doesn't mean I'm right. When you look at the meaning of "norm" I'd have to say you're right - setback has been a big part of the past.

The thing that I can't help remembering is the point in time during flight training when we all had to get our bodies measured. They wanted to see what planes/helos you'd fit into - or not. Turns out they have a set of norms and if you're on the edge they have to do a special evaluation and you can wind up not being able to fly certain aircraft b/c you won't safely fit. One of the things guys would do is try and get themselves disqaulified from certain aircraft so they could only fly the others. Othertimes guys would stick it out knowing that they might lose their knees if they had to eject (the A-4 is a pretty tight fit on a large person), but if they made it they could fly the plane they really wanted.
re: Bar & StemAtombomber
Aug 21, 2001 6:56 PM
When I got my new OCLV Trek, it came with Icon bar, stem and post. I was going to replace them with something Italian, since I thought they were an inferior product. Other than having to sand off the anodizing on the bar/stem interface because of slipping issues, all three items have been great.

Just because it isn't Italian doesn't mean its crap.
re: Bar & Stemgrzy mnky
Aug 22, 2001 8:50 AM
Whoever said it HAD to be Italian to be any good? Got some failed Cinelli parts in the junk bin. Deda had a pretty good recall on their Newton stem. No one nationality owns the road bike industry anymore. I would say that the USA is ahead in the MTB world in general, but the vast majority of components are made east of Italy.
BTW - he's going with an American frame.

However, the ICON stuff doesn't belong on a Seven - in my opinion. I had an OCLV (also American) and that first generation stuff was crappy. The newer stuff is admittedly better, but it still seems dorky and excessively price oriented (i.e. how can we make it cheaper?). Vertical integration is a great way to keep costs down and Trek's volume makes it a worth while effort. There's not many absolute "right and wrong" answers in the bike world - the stuff varies by degrees along a continuum - it's a question of values, both subjective and objective.